Hummingbird Pickguard curling up

[Gabor]

Hi Guys 

I am new to this site, but own a few Gibson's.  I live in Sydney Australia and used to travel to the USA a lot with my work, so most of my guitars were bought there and hand carried back here.

My concern is that I bought a Hummingbird in 2007 via EBAY in the USA and it is a 2007 build.  It is a beautiful guitar.  But the pickguard has been lifting and curling up approximately 0.5" / 1cm  around all the edges but still quite firm in the middle sections and no lifting around the sound hole.  This has been the case for most of its' life.  I've always just pushed is back onto the glue and it holds for some time until it starts to lift again.  I keep the guitar indoors and our temperature here is quite stable where I keep my guitars.   But lately it is really becoming annoying.

I understand this is not an uncommon issue, and I have never used any silicone polishes as it has never needed it.  One luthier I asked said to just live with it (not great if I ever want to re-sell it).  Someone else said to glue the accessible area down with something stronger like superglue.  But surely that would damage the finish or run!  Surely this is not an insurmountable problem is it?   

1/  I am unsure how I can best lift the rest of the pickguard where the glue is still sticking without casing damage or breaking the pickguard

2/  Then i am unsure as to the best way of cleaning off the glue from both the back of the pickguard ,and also from the top of the guitar without damaging the paint job and finish

3/  I have read elsewhere about using a hairdryer to deflex the pickguard and then placing some books on it to eliminate the flexing  and then putting it back on

4/  And I am unsure what glue would actually be suitable to be used to hold it down permanently, and what to use to mop o any excess that comes out on reattaching the pickguard.

Thank you in advance for all your responses and advice.  

Edited August 9, 2021 by Gabor
added some additional points

[fortyearspickn]

Do Not Use Super Glue.   Whoever suggested that ....     See if you can find some  3M  double sided tape.  The tape that is as thin as a BandAid, not as thick as a piece of toast. Apply some hairdryer heat to the pg - just a bit to soften it up, but not affect the glue.  Apply the tape and weight it down with a book.   Then cross your fingers.    That's a quick fix that may very well not work.  Because   I'm surprised and concerned that you P/G  is lifting a half inch.  That is  more than the normal 'curling'.  You may need a new luthier if he thinks you should live with it.  There is a thread on here,  updated 4 or 5 months ago,  on how to remove a p/g.   I don't recall any discussing how to fix a p/g which is taking on the shape of a cereal bowl.  G'Luck ! 

 

[Gabor]

Thanks fortyearspickn.  My luthier has long retired and moved away and another  luthier I called just said leave it as it is.  But he warned me never to use anything like superglue.  It is only curling up about 0.5" but seems more at the pointy ends.  So perplexing as i can see the glue lifting in stands where the pickguard has lifted.  I just want to avoid and damage to the timber. A pickguard can easily be replaced if broken.  I am waiting on Gibson's local distributor to call me back to see if they can advise an authorized repairer so if they damage it then it will be covered by liability insurance.  There is no rush as it has been like this for 14-years.   I just thought perhaps i could get the pickguard off and go from there first.  Many thanks.

[Buc McMaster]

Indeed this is a common issue with Gibson guards.  Easily corrected though.  Get some of this 3M adhesive from Stewart Mac.  A hair drier  on low heat will warm the guard enough to soften the glue and allow for easy removal.  Don't overheat the top.......just warm it a bit and work the guard up slowly.  Clean the guitar and the guard with lighter fluid.  Apply the new adhesive sheet to the guard and then to the guitar, being careful with placement because it will freaking STICK.  I've done this on three different Hummingbirds and it's worked perfectly each time.

[Hall]

Gabor, you want 3M 300LSE double sided adhesive sheets.  I have used on HB guard.  Re-stick the entire thing with this and your problems are in the past.   There is a post with good directions on here somewhere.   Maybe one of the computer knowledgables on the forum here can find it for you.  If not, I'll look.

[Gabor]

Sincere thanks everyone.  My biggest concern was if to, and how to remove the guard completely.  I guess it must be slow and careful.  I have just never mucked around with trying to fix something like this on an expensive  guitar like this.   

[fortyearspickn]

Gabor,    here's a link to the post describing the process:    

 

[Gabor]

Many thanks everyone.  Here are 2 photos that show the extent of the curling.  when I gently lift the pickguard the glue is clear but looks like when you lift a hot pizza up and the soft cheese stretches up with it with long gluggy strands.  I am sure you folks know what I mean. 

So in order to use the double sided tape, i really have to carefully remove the pickguard and clean off the top of the guitar and back of the pickguard and start over.  Top priority is to leave the top undamaged.   

Also finally was able to get the photos going! 

Thanks for being so patient.

[docr]

Gabor, I have the same problem with a 2018 Hummingbird. Lifting started some weeks after I have bought the very nice guitar. I had been re-glued by an authorized Gibson service point which is not so easy to find in Germany. Same with the often mentioned, famous 3M adhesive sheets from StewMac - export to Europe is not so easy due to custom duties and taxes. I do not now which type of adhesive the service guy has used but it lifted again after 1 year.

I have removed the pickguard carefully as described above, cleaned everthing with lighter fluid and have tried to convince the curling pickguard to be flatt. This did not work anyhow. I heated the pickguard up, pressed the warm pickguard between heavy books, re-heated etc. - there seems to be a memory effect in the material curling again when it is cooling down even if it was flatt at higher temperatures.  So any adhesive tape or sheet will have to resist the "curling forces" for a long time.

There is no chance to buy an original replacement pickguard from Gibson so I am waiting for an aftermarket replacement pickguard which hopefully will look good and be flatt. Of course I have kept the original pickguard for any cases the replacement part will not work.

As mentioned in other threads. I love my Gibson acoustics and I always wanted to have an original Hummingbird as I started playing guitar in 1978 on an Ibanez HB clone. No as an old guy I had the money  for the new guitar, but the quality of the pickguard is disappointing.  Pickguards on my J35, J185 or Advanced Jumbo maple to not move a millimeter.

Good luck with the repair work!

[olie]

I'm surprised that Gibson hasn't attempted to come up with a fix for what seems to be a fairly common problem.

There appears to be something about the H-Bird guard that makes it want to curl up, so they might have to re-invent the process.

They'd make a lot of folks happy if they could work it out. (Sort of like Martin's binding issue.)

 

[kelly campbell]

Why does Gibson not sell the acoustic guards?  They sell the LP replacements..they are missing some extra cash.

 

[kidblast]

51 minutes ago, kelly campbell said:

Why does Gibson not sell the acoustic guards?  They sell the LP replacements..they are missing some extra cash.

 

a better question is why don't they do something about the lifting/curling up BS on the pickguards.

when you're paying $4k and north for an acoustic guitar, it shouldn't do this kind of crap.

[Buc McMaster]

2 hours ago, docr said:

There is no chance to buy an original replacement pickguard from Gibson so I am waiting for an aftermarket replacement pickguard which hopefully will look good and be flatt.

These guards appear to be among the best out there in the aftermarket.  Expensive?  Reckon so, but what of quality is cheap?

MV Custom

[docr]

The "aftermarket" supplier I have mentioned above is MV - I have ordered a pickguard some weeks ago. Quite easy as in the EU. Got an order confirmation after short time, delivery date end of September as they have closed due to summer holidays at the moment. No problem if the new pickguard will fit, stick and look good. I can give an update as soon as I have fixed it on my Hummingbird.

As Kelly Campbell writes - why do they not sell replacement pickguards? I would have tried to get an original one from Gibson.  Fear of product piracy? On the other hand you can buy tuners with original "Gibson" logo - for example at Thomann. Needed replacement for my 61  SG Special as I wrecked one, no problem.

I would look for a replacement pickguard for my J45 VS from 2016 - same problem but not so eye-catching as it has a simpler shape. Same kind of "flubby" pickguard on my Southern Jumbo makes no problem ... hard to understand.

[Mime]

Im assuming it’s a “flubber” pickguard.  A previous post discussed how to fix this permanently without buying a new Pickguard. I can’t vouch for it but it’s worth a shot. 

 

[Paul14]

7 hours ago, kelly campbell said:

Why does Gibson not sell the acoustic guards?  They sell the LP replacements..they are missing some extra cash.

 

Even if they did, who wants 2 of these things? Better to redesign the guard.

[jchabalk]

6 hours ago, Paul14 said:

13 hours ago, kelly campbell said:

Why does Gibson not sell the acoustic guards?  They sell the LP replacements..they are missing some extra cash.

 

Even if they did, who wants 2 of these things? Better to redesign the guard.

Well, the LP guards around $20-$30USD and the fancy engraved Hummingbird and SJ-200 guards cost >$200 if i remember correctly. They'll let you buy one as long as you can prove you're the original owner of the guitar, it seems to be a bit subjective. But at the same time at that steep price it's a bit off putting.

[Gabor]

Thank you all for fantastic feedback and commentary.  This subject appears ageless and i would also have expected a company like Gibson to have got a fix on it.  

[ALD323]

On 8/10/2021 at 3:39 PM, Mime said:

Im assuming it’s a “flubber” pickguard.  A previous post discussed how to fix this permanently without buying a new Pickguard. I can’t vouch for it but it’s worth a shot. 

 

...Remember...the pick guard must be melted with the hair dryer until you actually SEE the curl dissappear WHILE you are heating it...THEN press it between books. You will see the pick guard become FLAT before your eyes as you heat it. If you do NOT see the curl relax, then you did not heat it long enough, or hard enough. In which case it will lift again because the curl has not be removed. The pick guard MUST lay FLAT on a surface before re-installing it..or it will come off again. The glue, no matter how strong, will never overcome the exertion of the curl pulling against it..so the curl MUST be removed as stated above, till fully flat. Then re-install it and it will stay put...for life.

Edited September 1, 2021 by ALD323

[Gabor]

Sincere thanks  everyone.

Now I just need to get it off without damaging the guitars surface and then clean off the glue. using some of the suggestions above,

Thank you  

[Dave F]

1 hour ago, Gabor said:

Sincere thanks  everyone.

Now I just need to get it off without damaging the guitars surface and then clean off the glue. using some of the suggestions above,

Thank you  

I haven’t tried it but some very knowledgeable members here have used naphtha and dental floss. 

[ALD323]

2 hours ago, Gabor said:

Sincere thanks  everyone.

Now I just need to get it off without damaging the guitars surface and then clean off the glue. using some of the suggestions above,

Thank you  

Naptha (common lighter fluid) used for cigarette lighters and lighting grills will work perfectly. I used it to remove my own Gibson Hummingbird pick guard which lifted due to curl. "Zero damage" to the niro finish occured....Zero! Just don't scrape too hard and use a soft cloth to rub the gooey naptha glue mess.. Don't let any Naptha enter the sound hole ,or run through the sound hole to the bracing..it WILL melt glue. ..But not Nitro. Stuff and cover the sound hole with a heavy cotton rag like an old T- shirt. Soak and lift the guard off, tugging it firmly but lightly, and keep spritzing the sides of the pick guard to get the naptha under the pick guard. Don't rush it! When the lighter fluid soaks a few minutes the glue will soften and get very gooey, and then gently ..GENTLY tug the pick guard off. ...You will see the trouble causing curl right away when the guard has been removed. Then proceed with the straightening process...then after cleaning the guitar both top and back of pickguard, re-apply the adhesive to the back of the now "completely" flattened pick guard, and carefully re-apply it to the top of your guitar. Best of luck. ..the Naptha will work wonders, with zero affect on the nitro, no matter how long it needs to be soaked to loosen the guard it will not harm nitro..so no worries. Good luck!! 

Edited September 1, 2021 by ALD323

[E-minor7]

1 hour ago, Dave F said:

I haven’t tried it but some very knowledgeable members here have used naphtha and dental floss. 

Count me in - naphtha, floss and a dated credit card.

[Dave F]

39 minutes ago, E-minor7 said:

Count me in - naphtha, floss and a dated credit card.

Floss sounds better than scrapping carefully and I'll definitely will try that if I ever need to. The only ones I've done have been falling off and didn't take much effort.

[Gabor]

Sincere thanks again.  You fellow warriors have been so helpful.   I live in Sydney Australia and contacted Bozeman direct about this problem, and also their local distributor to seek advice.  Guess what they both have in common? No response at all and it remains so quiet on the home front!  Given that we all spend a lot of money on these instruments, and I only learnt how common a problem it is, you would think they should be more forthcoming.  All i wanted was a local luthier who i could get to fix this, as the ones I have contacted have all shied away from it!

At the end of this process, i may well write to their CEO and let him know how 'helpful' their people are!

Nevertheless, all your feedback has given me more confidence to try to fix it myself - but ever so slowly and step by step! 

So two final questions regarding de-flexing and then reattachment.

1/  After the deflexing process using a blow dryer (very carefully), will I leave the pickguard on the shelf for a while just to be sure the flexing has gone. If so, how long would you recommend?

2/  In relation to re-attaching the de-flexed pickguard, I have read some of you have used a very thin 3M double sided tape which would require me to trace the pickguard shape  on it and then cut it out.  If I use this method, how far in from the edge of the pickguard should I cut the 3M sheet to ensure it cannot be seen?  I also assume this product is clear so it wont be seen from any angle above?  I am also assuming I can buy it here in Sydney which i will check on.

3/  Alternatively, if I try to glue it back, can anyone advise the recommended glue to do this, and perhaps how much glue to put o on?  Do you use a small brush and put it on all of the pickguard our perhaps just inside the outer dimensions of the pickguard.  Also I assume no glue to be initially put on the guitar - only on the back of the pickguard.

Thank you so much everyone.  I am so very grateful.