shredding? why are most people down on playing fast...

[Jeff-7]

I don't mind it in small doses, going from a nice rythm to a little shredding breakdown can make a song enjoyable, but I don't enjoy listening to 3 minutes straight of fretboard gymnastics.

[duane v]

I enjoy players that can play fast

[NeoConMan]

Do you enjoy players who play slow?

[bluesguitar65]

The logic in this argument is a little lacking. I don't have boobs, but I like them.

 

It actually took me a while to learn to slow down. I still dive in too fast sometimes (just ask my wife). Good solos blend slow and fast passages. The fast bits can be a little short on melody I find. I'm still learning to save the speed (legato runs and tremolo picking in my case- no sweeping for me) for right time.

Would you have a sound clip or a youtube?

[ChanMan]

He's posted up before...

 

You still got that link to Crossroads, Surf???

 

 

It DID inspire me to learn to play and sing it.... :)!!!

 

 

 

Oh wait.... you meant the boobs, didn't ya?

 

 

:unsure:

[Duende]

I hold the same view of music as I do I literature; in that a great poem (or novel) is one that uses the simplest words to speak to the reader and only uses longer words when the story requires it. The story and it's communication to the is the most paramount thing and comes first. Milod and Norton make great points about how people regard speed in music and the nonsensical nature of some so called 'shredders', as they appear to bypass musicality and go straight to the technical core.

 

Players from various genres such as Django Reinhardt, Julian Bream, John 5, Randy Rhoads and Paco de Lucia could mistakenly be called 'shredders', but in my opinion they are great artists, who have the facility to play fast if the music requires it! There is a big difference between that and playing fast for the sake of it.

 

Matt

[Duende]

ps

 

I cannot and wont ever 'get over' Bach. One of only a handful of musicians that I would say were genius' (another word that gets bandied about as much as lame LOL)

 

It is amazing how his music sends messages straight to the heart and head in equal measure, yes it can be so fast and complicated, but it is ALWAYS musical.

[Versatile]

Al DiMeola has a unique perspective on the 'shred' experience

 

I dig his playing somewhat

 

[FirstMeasure]

So, if I can pull of "Eruption" flawlessly, and even speed it up a little, I'm not a Guitar God?

 

I know your comment was tongue in cheek, but no. you have to write "Eruption", or something as relevant to be a "Guitar God". If you can play Eruption flawlessly it means you have a good memory and extremely good dexterity.

[S t e v e]

No, I can't shred, and I don't want to

Why do you think we don't like shredding because we can't?

 

 

 

I can't fingerpick, but I like bluegrass

I can't play the sax, but I like Coltrane

I can't play the solo to Freewill, but I love it

 

i wasn't having a pop at anyone just thought it would be a good debatable topic

 

intersting read guys B)

[damian]

i wasn't having a pop at anyone just thought it would be a good debatable topic

 

intersting read guys B)

 

Good shred Steve, ah, I mean, um, good thread Jasper !!!!!!!!!!!!! Good debates and comments....Now we need a thread about Gary Moore, it's been at least three days since a new one has popped up !!!!!!!!!!!!! :blink: ...............

[NeoConMan]

I know your comment was tongue in cheek, but no.

If you can play Eruption flawlessly it means you have a good memory and extremely good dexterity.

 

Years ago, if I was in Guitar Center and some kid was thrashing Eruption or some other "Look At Me" piece I would start into this;

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=COrLwXFbBcw

 

 

The guys working in the store would laugh so hard...

[ChanMan]

Matt, with all due respect, John 5 carries the shred banner high and is proud of it.

 

 

And rightfully so, imho. He has done more for making me want a Tele than any other artist. What a talent!!!

[duane v]

If one can play the stairway to heaven guitar solo with some amount of style...... he or she is a shredder IMO

[damian]

If one can play the stairway to heaven guitar solo with some amount of style...... he or she is a shredder IMO

 

 

Oh boy !!!!! I'm a shredder !!!!!!! When I finished learning the Bodihisatta solo note per note I began considering myself good, but not a shredder !!!!!!!

 

But now !!!!!!!!! REAL bragging rights !!!!!!!!!!!!!! Hey Jasper, I'm a shredder, I like shredders !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :unsure:

[Silenced Fred]

It depends. In small doses, its great. When someone busts out into a solo, and uses a bit o' shredding to taste, its wonderful.

 

Shredding is like the icing on a cake. A little bit is good, too much will make you tired of it and kill you

[FirstMeasure]

Years ago, if I was in Guitar Center and some kid was thrashing Eruption or some other "Look At Me" piece I would start into this;

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=COrLwXFbBcw

 

 

The guys working in the store would laugh so hard...

LOL! I'm stealing your idea, I'm gonna do that next time. I hope it's not to out of date for today's GC staffers.

[Notes_Norton]

There are a couple of things needed to make good music. Technique and talent.

 

You can teach technique to just about anyone who is willing to put the time in. Talent is something you cannot teach, either a player has it or doesn't. If he has it, you can help him/her develop it but that's it.

 

When I worked in my duo on the cruise ships, the people in the orchestra were more often than not youngsters just out of impressive jazz schools like North Texas State and the University Of Miami. They all knew all the Coltrane and Bird riffs backwards and forwards, and most of them simply played a lot of empty notes because they didn't have the talent to make music out of the notes.

 

However, there were the few who were blessed with inborn talent who also learned the same technique. These were the people that were delightful to listen to.

 

I want to hear music, not technique. But it takes technique to play the music that you feel.

 

Plus what tickles my personal ears does not have to tickle yours. If we all liked the same thing there would be only one type of music.

 

Players who play a lot of empty notes (in my opinion) are technically competent but uninspiring to me. Players who have a lot of talent and control of their instrument have a far better chance of moving me personally.

 

Speed isn't everything, and too much of it gets boring to me. But it's OK for others.

 

IMHO there are only two kinds of music.

1) Good music

2) Music made for somebody else's ears.

 

Notes ♫

[Duende]

Matt, with all due respect, John 5 carries the shred banner high and is proud of it.

 

 

And rightfully so, imho. He has done more for making me want a Tele than any other artist. What a talent!!!

 

Equal respect back my friend, but in my opinion John 5 is an awesome musician first and foremost and only termed a shredder by the media and the internet, as they focus on his technique and not his musicality and artistry.

 

The slang term we all use of 'shred' is just a by product of what someone like John 5 does. Like Buckehead, his music is very inventive and creative and not speed for speeds sake but rather art for arts sake in my opinion :)

 

Matt

 

 

 

[damian]

Well Jasper, in regards to that Yogi Malstreem dude; Scallops are for dinner, not fret boards !!

 

In jest, of course.....

[canon_mutant]

Though I would be less than honest if I didn't admit that part of the problem is not liking or perhaps more importantly not getting the particular genre we call shredding but more accurately I don't understand the point of playing 32nd notes up and down the fretboard for the sake of playing 32nd notes up and down the fretboard and popping off a squeally every now and then, half of which don't even mix in the particular key of the tune. But perhaps that's the whole point to this particular genre that I don't get? As in another form of anti-establishment rebellion somehow? Different form of punk?

 

Beyond shredding though players like Page and [yes] Moore along with Vai and Satriani are better players than I'll ever be, the reason they're not at the top of my list is that they spend too much time just playing fast for the sake of playing fast. When I hear Moore play blues it just brings tears to my eyes and not in a good way. Slow the "frack" down and put some feeling into it damn it . . . Page nears the top of my list mainly for is less popular non-top 40 work.

 

This is also why players like Gilmour are at the top of my list even though others are technically and fundamentally better guitar players. What he plays moves me. Shredding simply moves me to change the channel or station.

 

Now as Milod I believe stated, show me a classical guitarist playing 32nd notes up and down the scale, though it's not my favorite genre, I'll listen, enjoy, and respect it because it will not be playing fast for the sake of playing fast and the notes will absolutely be in key and fit the piece.

[ChanMan]

Equal respect back my friend, but in my opinion John 5 is an awesome musician first and foremost and only termed a shredder by the media and the internet, as they focus on his technique and not his musicality and artistry.

 

The slang term we all use of 'shred' is just a by product of what someone like John 5 does. Like Buckehead, his music is very inventive and creative and not speed for speeds sake but rather art for arts sake in my opinion :)

 

Matt

 

 

 

 

 

Agreed.

 

I was just more or less quoting him from an interview in Guitar World, where he basically said "Yeah, I'm a shredder and I'm proud of it." I've gotta say his musicianship, to me, far out paces the label "shredder", as most folks tend to think of it.

 

[ChanMan]

Now as Milod I believe stated, show me a classical guitarist playing 32nd notes up and down the scale, though it's not my favorite genre, I'll listen, enjoy, and respect it because it will not be playing fast for the sake of playing fast and the notes will absolutely be in key and fit the piece.

 

 

Yngwie plays Bach and Mozart.... and he is considered a prime shredder.... and folks hate him.

 

I'm sorry.... if he plays a classical piece using 32nd notes, then a piece he wrote that utilizes 32nd notes.... what exactly is the distinction? I'm not sure I understand why Bach is allowed to use them, but if anyone else does it's crap.

 

I'm not being a d!ck.... I'm trying to understand the difference.

 

 

 

I "get" that we don't care for an entire song of 32nd notes....( or 64th notes [yes, our bass player once wrote a tune that involved me playing 64th notes for the entire song] ), but I'm not sure I get why classical composers can use them, but modern composers can't.... as that seems to be the thrust here.

[ChanMan]

Well Jasper, in regards to that Yogi Malstreem dude; Scallops are for dinner, not fret boards !!

 

In jest, of course.....

 

 

I kinda like the Vai signature Ibanez with the scallops above the (12th?) fret. It was a lot easier to hit the notes.

 

I was NOT as impressed with the entire fretboard scalloped..... though I am told that you'd very quickly adapt and find it difficult to go back to a standard neck.

 

 

To me that is just one more reason to avoid it! :D

[canon_mutant]

Yngwie plays Bach and Mozart.... and he is considered a prime shredder.... and folks hate him.

 

I'm sorry.... if he plays a classical piece using 32nd notes, then a piece he wrote that utilizes 32nd notes.... what exactly is the distinction? I'm not sure I understand why Bach is allowed to use them, but if anyone else does it's crap.

 

I'm not being a d!ck.... I'm trying to understand the difference.

 

And I'm not either, BTW . . .

 

My point which maybe I didn't make well was that in shredding there is fast soloing for what appears to just be the sake of fast soloing where notes are being played that don't even fit in the key being played vs other genres like classical where fast notes are being played as a part of a particular melodic solo composition where the notes actually do fit the overall composition and in the key being played.

 

My point was also beyond shredding though in that even Page and others just start hitting notes that sound frankly like mistakes to me especially live because they don't fit the key when they just start blistering the fretboard. I think the music suffers when it basically turns into . . . well "watch this" rather than listen to this.