Hogeye Posted December 21, 2016 Share Posted December 21, 2016 I got a very nice call from an old friend, Kevin Kopp. Kevin and I share a couple of interests. We both like a good breakfast any time of day as well as a perfectly executed short scale, slope shoulder dreadnaught. It seems Kevin had just shipped his last batch of guitars for the year and had some time off. He heard of a new place to eat close to campus and wanted to try it out. He knocked on the back door without his pal and longtime pet Gingy. She is a favorite of mine and I was hoping to see her but it was -20 degrees Fahrenheit so she stayed home next to the heat register. Well, off we went and had a great afternoon breakfast. It seems that Gibson had served him with a cease and desist order. Since he was done building for the year it wasn't to big of a deal. His next batch of guitars for new year will have a new design. The peghead shape and some of the pickguards are the offenders. Kevin makes about as many guitars in a year as Gibson makes in a day so you have to wonder just how much he was hurting their business. I guess the many other Gibson models being produced by other builders are not a problem. Needless to say we had a good laugh at Gibson's expense. I will try to keep you updated on Kevin's new production of guitars and what the design changes will be. He will have his new website up and running soon. It seems he's more worried about the Rosewood ban than anything else at this point. It's not easy being a small shop. He does have the advantage of being able to adapt rather quickly. He is going to weather the current storm just fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slimt Posted December 21, 2016 Share Posted December 21, 2016 Soo that -20 onits way up to here? Kind of sad to see gibson act the way they do. Its not like there getting better with what they have to offer. Hope to see the new breed of fine kopp guitars soon too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duluthdan Posted December 21, 2016 Share Posted December 21, 2016 I'm a big fan of all day breakfast too. Peghead design and pick guard shape? Perhaps the corporate lawyers at Gibson had nothing left to do so close to the holidays... Bah Humbug! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hall Posted December 21, 2016 Share Posted December 21, 2016 TOO 'much ado', on Gibson's part. Looking forward to the new Kopp, models Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
62burst Posted December 21, 2016 Share Posted December 21, 2016 Dear Gibson, sometimes you make it hard to love you. Why do you do stuff like this? Is Kevin Kopp even competing in the same price range as Gibson? Many of Kevin's guitars are on the other side of $5K. No hard feelings? Some people would just rather play a Gibson, and it could be at around half the cost. The idea tossed around is that some of Gibson and/or Martin's greatest competition is old Gibsons and Martins, respectively. This especially applies to the reissues. But even there, it's a significant price difference. A big breakfast, Mexican-style is a favorite here, too. Even late in the day- 'cause sometimes that's when I get to it. Stay warm up there, Hogeye. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rct Posted December 21, 2016 Share Posted December 21, 2016 Mr. Kopp makes some really nice guitars. I will treat him the same way Gibson would like to be treated, and when he comes up with some terrific innovation or settles on a headstock and pickguard that define him uniquely, I won't copy it and charge people money for my copy of it. I would bet he would appreciate not having to cease and desist me or anyone else. rct Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J-1854Me Posted December 21, 2016 Share Posted December 21, 2016 Oh admit it, Hogeye -- Kevin's not THAT old!! Haven't seen Kevin in some while, but I did call him when we were in BZN last summer. Too bad about the cease/desist thing, but so it goes....<sigh>. Fred Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murph Posted December 21, 2016 Share Posted December 21, 2016 Mr. Kopp makes some really nice guitars. I will treat him the same way Gibson would like to be treated, and when he comes up with some terrific innovation or settles on a headstock and pickguard that define him uniquely, I won't copy it and charge people money for my copy of it. Boom ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boyd Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 How about some pictures of the headstocks and pickguards? IMO, stealing someone else's intellectual property is wrong no matter how large or small the company is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnneS Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 Mr. Kopp makes some really nice guitars. I will treat him the same way Gibson would like to be treated, and when he comes up with some terrific innovation or settles on a headstock and pickguard that define him uniquely, I won't copy it and charge people money for my copy of it. I would bet he would appreciate not having to cease and desist me or anyone else. rct Yep-- "big guy versus little guy" is not the only way to look at the picture. Well said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjl200 Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 Mr. Kopp makes some really nice guitars. I will treat him the same way Gibson would like to be treated, and when he comes up with some terrific innovation or settles on a headstock and pickguard that define him uniquely, I won't copy it and charge people money for my copy of it. I would bet he would appreciate not having to cease and desist me or anyone else. rct 🤜🎤✋️ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blindboygrunt Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 I have to say , and I've no connection nor knowledge of Kevin kopp guitars , have only heard praise for them. But using the Gibson headstock design is quite obviously used as a connection to Gibson guitars. Whether or not Gibson should worry about it is for them to decide , but it's obviously used as a guide to what to expect from his guitars If he was making cola and had a red and white tin we'd all know what was going on eh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boyd Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 But using the Gibson headstock design is quite obviously used as a connection to Gibson guitars. Whether or not Gibson should worry about it is for them to decide , but it's obviously used as a guide to what to expect from his guitars Since nobody else answered, I found this with Google: http://gregboyd.com/instruments.html?family=Guitars&sound=acoustic&maker=Kevin%20Kopp&in_stock=sold The connection to Gibson couldn't be more "obvious" since he has models named K-35, K-185, K-200, AJ, etc. I guess the lawyers have to decide this kind of thing, but could he really be surprised that Gibson was not amused? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
62burst Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 Is this similar to how the design of the body of Martin’s square-shoulder dreadnoughts was copied for the Gibson Hummingbird, or is that particular iteration of bilateral symmetry in the public domain? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rct Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 Is this similar to how the design of the body of Martin’s square-shoulder dreadnoughts was copied for the Gibson Hummingbird, or is that particular iteration of bilateral symmetry in the public domain? A "guitar" can only be certain shaped, right? So you can't absolutely own a shape that is considered an integral part of the object itself, sorta like saying hey I put tires on "car"s so you can't. Long ago the very small, very minor skirmish that resulted in tens of thousands of what are erroneously called Lawsuit Guitars was quite simply that the headstock shape and script used on it could be mistaken from a reasonable distance, I don't remember what that distance was. Headstocks can vary, and the scripts used on them. One look at those Love Rocks or the Ibanez strats and teles back then and you can see why, finally, somebody(Forest White) convinced Fender to do something, along with Gibson. You can make tele, strat, Les Paul, Hummingbird shaped guitars, you just can't copy someone elses trademark, servicemark, or "dress" as they used to call it. rct Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blindboygrunt Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MissouriPicker Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 Wow, someone at Tak wasn't very smart. That one is a "no brainer." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mountainpicker Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 The problem lies in the universe I call lawyerland. In lawyerland if Gibson doesn't adress Mr. Kopp it could be construed as "precedent setting" which then opens a Pandora's box through which a flood of lawyerland ruffians will flow. Time for jt1 to inform those of us in consternation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dotneck Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 I don't know what the problem is. this one says Kopp on it. Its not disguised as a gibson. I don't even know how gibson found out about these. kevin lives miles from the bozeman facility. Small world I guess... By the way...it sure does look pretty... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Scales Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 If the lawyers couldn't make a buck out of it, none of these 'issues' would ever see the light of day (IMO). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rct Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 If the lawyers couldn't make a buck out of it, none of these 'issues' would ever see the light of day (IMO). It really was an issue, you can't just copy peoples stuff and expect to get rich off it. If it weren't for lawyers, in this instance our hosts would be sending goon squads to the guys house to get him to stop. Which do people prefer? rct Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mountainpicker Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 I prefer no goon squads AND no lawyers bothering Mr. Kopp, i.e. a sense of perspective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rct Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 I prefer no goon squads AND no lawyers bothering Mr. Kopp, i.e. a sense of perspective. Or perhaps Mr. Kopp... eh. Nevermind. rct Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Scales Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 Peter Sellers would have been in disguise and using a sinister accent - you may be on to something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slimt Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 Kopp will come up with a design and guard that will be just fine. Off shore guitars adorn everything that gibson builds but it seems there to big to stop .there still building and selling. Whats being done there . the sad part is consumers get dupped on those. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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