merciful-evans Posted January 23, 2022 Share Posted January 23, 2022 I was going to add this to Pinch's `humidity and neck relief thread' but thought better of it. We are all trying to keep setups within a couple of thou (0.002" inch) with hardware attached to lumps of wood. Question: Is wood really the best material for the job? Answer: Its traditional. ...oh yeah; and its got tone in it. Would anyone consider, or even try out an alternative material? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinch Posted January 23, 2022 Share Posted January 23, 2022 I know there are carbon fibre acoustics, but I've never played one. I think wood would be hard to replace. It even needs to be particular woods. Look at basswood - IMHO, bad tone. And it's still a wood, so related to e.g. mahogany. You'd need something as resonant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merciful-evans Posted January 23, 2022 Author Share Posted January 23, 2022 I'm surprised to hear a negative report of basswood. I've never played a basswood guitar, but heard positive reviews of them. There have been carbon fibre electrics too. I'm not aware of any currently though. There was brand called Flaxwood. The material they designed was called flaxwood too. I first noticed these in a photo Rabs put up year ago when he showed his guitars at a Guitar event/show. They were on a stand close by his. They called the material natural fibre-reinforced thermoplastic composites. I tried a cheaper one with a flaxwood neck and a wood body. I hated the sound. At the time I put this down to the pickups. I might have been wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinch Posted January 23, 2022 Share Posted January 23, 2022 50 minutes ago, merciful-evans said: I'm surprised to hear a negative report of basswood. I've never played a basswood guitar, but heard positive reviews of them. Could be just me. It's used in cheap Ibanez's and Jacksons, and sounds bad to my ears. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rct Posted January 23, 2022 Share Posted January 23, 2022 1 hour ago, merciful-evans said: We are all trying to keep setups within a couple of thou (0.002" inch) with hardware attached to lumps of wood. Question: Is wood really the best material for the job? Setting up a guitar and then having it live through ordinary changes in temperature and humidity has been vastly overwrought, over thought, exaggerated, mystified, glamorized, glorified, horrified, polarized, and complicated. The short answer is set up your guitar, keep your house at a temperature/humidity relationship that has you and your family and your pets comfortable. Take your guitar out and use it, bring it home, lather, rinse repeat. When you change strings, check the measurements that exist that make your neck function properly, all the specs of a set up, which isn't many. You will find that you rarely have to change stuff if you aren't changing string gauge/maker all the time. A guitar is made to live through ordinary changes in temperature/humidity just fine. We have been doing this with them since way long before there was an internet over which guitar players could wring their hands and pray the rosary over humidity fluctuations, and we lived through it all just fine. My guitars would point and laugh at me if they knew I was worrying about these things. "C'mon man, it's us, when have we let you down????". That's what they would say to me. rct 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rct Posted January 23, 2022 Share Posted January 23, 2022 I would, however, like to take a good long whack at them expensive fancy carbon fiber acoustic thingies. Seems like it could be fun if they sound good. rct 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fortyearspickn Posted January 23, 2022 Share Posted January 23, 2022 RCT, I was feeling I needed to go out and buy a straight edge and a micrometer until your 2 posts. Thanks, because while I don't know if my guitars have been laughing at me, I have caught my wife smirking when I get crazy if I run out of distilled water for the humidifier in my music room when the hydrometer dips to 40%. "My guitars would point and laugh at me if they knew I was worrying about these things. "C'mon man, it's us, when have we let you down????". That's what they would say to me." I am reminded of my one and only '64 WOOD LG1 - kept in closets and under beds in 5 different states over 40 years - usually in its chipboard case without humidpaks, sponges or desiccants. It never let me down. Did try out a Rain Song 8 years ago in a Mom & Pop. Sounded great. But, felt stiff and artificial. That made the tone sound the same. So, while I was tempted to have a guitar I could use to paddle a canoe and hammer in tent stakes - with limited guitar funds - my next purchase was a J45. Final addition to complement my other 2 Gibsons. Which, are never in closets or under beds - only in cases when leaving the house. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinch Posted January 23, 2022 Share Posted January 23, 2022 1 hour ago, fortyearspickn said: while I don't know if my guitars have been laughing at me Mine stopped laughing at me at about the time I joined this forum. They've moved on to a look of genuine concern for me. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt. Pepper Posted January 23, 2022 Share Posted January 23, 2022 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Pinch said: Mine stopped laughing at me at about the time I joined this forum. They've moved on to a look of genuine concern for me. Mine laugh at me when I play them. That the best you got . . . Edited January 23, 2022 by Sgt. Pepper 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdgm Posted January 23, 2022 Share Posted January 23, 2022 (edited) I once had a Tokai 'MAT' (Most Advanced Technology) plastic-bodied Strat. 2 hbs I think. Sounded ok except above the 12th fret - even with new strings it just didn't sound quite right up there and eventually that began to bug me. Edited January 23, 2022 by jdgm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larsongs Posted January 23, 2022 Share Posted January 23, 2022 I played a Carbon Fiber Acoustic a few years back… I’m pretty sure it was a Martin.. IMO, it’s Sound didn’t compare to a high end Martin, Gibson, Guild or Collings… Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitefang Posted January 23, 2022 Share Posted January 23, 2022 I wouldn't mind my guitars laughing at me when I play. It's when the PEOPLE in the room start laughing is when I get upset. I don't recall( getting back on track) any who bought those early (c. '66) composite bodied Ovation guitars. And by the end of the '60's, when they overcame that seam breakage problem and switched to a composite parabolic back and side they became pretty popular. Endorsed by Glen Campbell they were played by a whole host of well respected artists(Cat Stevens being one). And then too, how about AIR as an alternative to wood?.................. Whitefang Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt. Pepper Posted January 23, 2022 Share Posted January 23, 2022 (edited) Think about this. Anyone own one of those plastic back Ovations (I did). It was the only non USA made guitar I ever owned. One of the worst ideas in guitar making. Now we taking acoustic, electric or both on different materials. An electric will take to different materials I think better than an acoustic will. Edited January 23, 2022 by Sgt. Pepper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabs Posted January 23, 2022 Share Posted January 23, 2022 Some alternatives. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mihcmac Posted January 23, 2022 Share Posted January 23, 2022 (edited) Alternative materials for guitars have been successful for a Lon time Acrylic Aluminum-minum-minum-minum To mention a few... and speaking of heavy metals, don't forget the Resonator. Edited January 23, 2022 by mihcmac 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merciful-evans Posted January 23, 2022 Author Share Posted January 23, 2022 4 hours ago, Whitefang said: I wouldn't mind my guitars laughing at me when I play. It's when the PEOPLE in the room start laughing is when I get upset. I don't recall( getting back on track) any who bought those early (c. '66) composite bodied Ovation guitars. And by the end of the '60's, when they overcame that seam breakage problem and switched to a composite parabolic back and side they became pretty popular. Endorsed by Glen Campbell they were played by a whole host of well respected artists(Cat Stevens being one). And then too, how about AIR as an alternative to wood?.................. Whitefang But man... I already GOT one of those things! Here's the proof 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merciful-evans Posted January 23, 2022 Author Share Posted January 23, 2022 I didn't know about the coffee bean guitar. It sounded good though. The cardboard strat and the concrete strat sounded like................. strats! That suggests that the design is more important. All the guitars that Rabs & mihcmac posted have wooden necks (not sure about the aluminium one?). So they still will need adjustment. Now its ok if you are motivated and energetic like rtc obviously is, but us slackers don't want to do all that work. It would be worth something to me if you can just set it up once and leave the dnam thing alone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabs Posted January 23, 2022 Share Posted January 23, 2022 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rct Posted January 23, 2022 Share Posted January 23, 2022 9 minutes ago, merciful-evans said: I didn't know about the coffee bean guitar. It sounded good though. The cardboard strat and the concrete strat sounded like................. strats! That suggests that the design is more important. All the guitars that Rabs & mihcmac posted have wooden necks (not sure about the aluminium one?). So they still will need adjustment. Now its ok if you are motivated and energetic like rtc obviously is, but us slackers don't want to do all that work. It would be worth something to me if you can just set it up once and leave the dnam thing alone. That is what I am essentially telling you. Set it up, leave it alone. Keep your house "normal" and your guitars are fine. I check them at string changes because I do. I don't do anything, haven't changed relief on my #1 but twice in 25 years, once when I changed gauge and once when I changed brand. I treat my expensive acoustics the same, by the way. The house is good, the guitars are good. rct Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merciful-evans Posted January 23, 2022 Author Share Posted January 23, 2022 1 minute ago, rct said: That is what I am essentially telling you. Set it up, leave it alone. Keep your house "normal" and your guitars are fine. I check them at string changes because I do. I don't do anything, haven't changed relief on my #1 but twice in 25 years, once when I changed gauge and once when I changed brand. I treat my expensive acoustics the same, by the way. The house is good, the guitars are good. rct I have to admit, ever since I got central heating installed, its gotten a lot easier. The one notable exception was the Epi Casino Coupe. That thing had the fidgets and was moved on for that reason. Maybe the wood was never properly heat treated? One thing about laziness. It can pay off. When one of the 2 guitars I leave out moved, instead of adjusting it, I just left it alone for another week and it returned to normal by itself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabs Posted January 23, 2022 Share Posted January 23, 2022 At the end of this one he does a side by side.. Really I think most electric guitars sound like electric guitars.. The rest IS down to tradition and expectation... Yes you do get differences in tone, but (as I have said many times now) thats why we have EQ, and pedals and volume/tone knobs.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merciful-evans Posted January 23, 2022 Author Share Posted January 23, 2022 27 minutes ago, Rabs said: Rabs, I have never seen any of these. Thank you for posting. The glass guitar has my favourite Schaller 3D6 bridge in it. I remember you considering using one in a build of yours once. Did you ever get one? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdgm Posted January 23, 2022 Share Posted January 23, 2022 We've also had fiberglass and metal drums, plastic saxophones, carbon fibre/composite violins, glass instruments - flutes, vibes as well as the guitar above. Everything gets tried. But it seems the old ways are in many cases the best; there is no better way (or material to use) to make a violin really, is there? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabs Posted January 23, 2022 Share Posted January 23, 2022 Just now, merciful-evans said: Rabs, I have never seen any of these. Thank you for posting. The glass guitar has my favourite Schaller 3D6 bridge in it. I remember you considering using one in a build of yours once. Did you ever get one? I did actually.. Planning on using it for the London Plane guitar (when I get around to finishing it.. This one 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabs Posted January 23, 2022 Share Posted January 23, 2022 Also remember those all aluminium Gitler guitars 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.