ccrnnr9 Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 I am looking to purchase a guitar for rhythm work. Concentrating on bass has given me a desire to be part of that rhythm section and has left me with a yearning to replace the guitar I sold. I have about $400 credit at MF that I want to use. I want the ability to play some gritty rhythmic blues in the style of Burnside, Kimbrough, Black Keys, etc and the ability to do psycadelic blues like Hendrix, Garcia, Jeff Beck, etc as well as bluesy jazz. So, that being said, I have a couple options I have come up with: Epiphone Dot: $399- I would keep it stock for the time being as it is at the ceiling of my price range. I say this but every one I have played seems a great value for $399. I love these little guys. I have played lots of them in stores and have always loved them. I just don't know if humbuckers will be as good for rhythm. Will they be articulate enough or am I best with a single coil? Also while I have loved every one I have played it seems that 'round here everyone is talking about the QC issues as of late. I know MF has their 45day guarantee but I would rather get it right the first time. Classic Vibe Telecaster: $350- I have a special place in my heart for teles but was wondering how it would hold up for rhythm. If you aren't aware of the CV teles they get a good reputation and I have played many and love them. They feel great, have the classic look and feel, and sound amazing. My only stipulation is that I really don't want a Les Paul or a strat...if i go the Fender route i like teles and if I go the Gibson route I like 335's. Your input is appreciated. I really do not want to consider anything else out there as in my price range I have literally played every model that MF has to offer and these have been my favs for months. I spent about an hour playing the two of these models back to back through a valve junior last week and I came away even more torn. Every time I put the tele in my hand I wanted a tele and every time the dot was in hand I wanted the dot. Your help is appreciated. I usually hang out at the tele forums (tdpri.com) and have posted this there. ES-335's and copies seem to be a second favorite among most of the members there. I should note I would consider upping my budget for a casino possibly I just don't know much about P90's and tonal differences from a standard dot. Just as a note whatever I get will be run through a Bitmo modded Epi Valve Jr and a tubescreamer pedal. Just a heads up. ~Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elsmacko Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 Let's face it; these are 2 totally different animals, I can't even see comparing the 2 really. If you want a warmer, fuller sound with more sustain I think the 335. If you want a trelby sound, the tele. And size.shapewise the differences are quite obvious, and one is semi hollow the other is solid. My vote is for the 335, but I like a thicker, fuller tone most of the time, especailly for rythm. You can always setup your humbuckers for coil tapping, or just go with p-90's. Coil tapped humbuckers would give you lots of toe variations available. I am looking to purchase a guitar for rhythm work. Concentrating on bass has given me a desire to be part of that rhythm section and has left me with a yearning to replace the guitar I sold. I have about $400 credit at MF that I want to use. I want the ability to play some gritty rhythmic blues in the style of Burnside' date=' Kimbrough, Black Keys, etc and the ability to do psycadelic blues like Hendrix, Garcia, Jeff Beck, etc as well as bluesy jazz. So, that being said, I have a couple options I have come up with: Epiphone Dot: $399- I would keep it stock for the time being as it is at the ceiling of my price range. I say this but every one I have played seems a great value for $399. I love these little guys. I have played lots of them in stores and have always loved them. I just don't know if humbuckers will be as good for rhythm. Will they be articulate enough or am I best with a single coil? Also while I have loved every one I have played it seems that 'round here everyone is talking about the QC issues as of late. I know MF has their 45day guarantee but I would rather get it right the first time. Classic Vibe Telecaster: $350- I have a special place in my heart for teles but was wondering how it would hold up for rhythm. If you aren't aware of the CV teles they get a good reputation and I have played many and love them. They feel great, have the classic look and feel, and sound amazing. My only stipulation is that I really don't want a Les Paul or a strat...if i go the Fender route i like teles and if I go the Gibson route I like 335's. Your input is appreciated. I really do not want to consider anything else out there as in my price range I have literally played every model that MF has to offer and these have been my favs for months. I spent about an hour playing the two of these models back to back through a valve junior last week and I came away even more torn. Every time I put the tele in my hand I wanted a tele and every time the dot was in hand I wanted the dot. Your help is appreciated. I usually hang out at the tele forums (tdpri.com) and have posted this there. ES-335's and copies seem to be a second favorite among most of the members there. I should note I would consider upping my budget for a casino possibly I just don't know much about P90's and tonal differences from a standard dot. Just as a note whatever I get will be run through a Bitmo modded Epi Valve Jr and a tubescreamer pedal. Just a heads up. ~Nick[/quote'] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ButchCassidy Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 Where to start... Our music tastes are very similar. I too like all the artists you mentioned. Which guitar would I recommend? Can't say. I have both styles and think they're both great for that type of music. RL Burnside mostly uses a telecaster, Kimbrough mostly used gibson style guitars (though I have seen him play some funky 80's metal looking guitars), John Lee Hooker uses Sheratons, and Dan Auerbach uses both. If you go the dot route though, I would definitely recommend getting it from the store and making sure everything is fine on it. From my own experience and from what I've seen/heard, some of these dots they're pumping out are total crapola. You might also want to try and find a Korean made one on craigslist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InsideMan Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 Go with the Dot. I think the range of sounds you can get from one is closer to what you are, or would like to be, into. If you buy from MF in order to use your store credit, don't be afraid to send it back if it doesn't play the way you like--even if only to exchange for another Dot. If you can get your store credit in cash, I'm with ButchCassidy--buy a guitar you have the chance to play first. There are storefronts that will sell you a Dot for the same price MF will--GuitarCenter comes to mind. Good luck with your hunt and enjoy your new guitar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
larkin38 Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 I loved my old Tele for rhythm guitar coz that`s primareily what I play. One thing Fenders have over most epi`s is you probably won`t have to change the pickups. The rear pick up will give you a nice chunky sound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antwhi2001 Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 Tele. 1. Teles' don't just do trebly twangy stuff. All the electric on the first Led Zep album is Tele (as is the solo on the studio version of Stairway). You can get some nice chunky rythm sounds out of them too 2. As someone said, you'll probably be happy with the stock pups 3. Fewer feedback issues if you want to do high gain high volume stuff Lots of good rock players gravitated towards Teles later in their careers; Beck, Mick Ronson, Dave Davies... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thermionik Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 At heart, I'm a big-fat-semi-acoustic player..... .....but from your description - no contest:- And I do love to play my Fraudcaster, sometimes simple basic design pays dividends. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freak show Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 Decisions, decisions... You've got a tough choice there, both guitars will probably make you happy. I don't think advice can help you, you've got to go with the one that sings to you the most and feels the best. I personally would go with the Tele. From what it says on the MF site, it's routed for a Humbucker, so you could definitely do some cool stuff with it down the road. I've got a Lite Ash Tele that I love, the quality is unbelievable. Fender seems to be offering a lot of guitar for a decent price at the moment, and that's something to think about. Just curious. I never played a Classic Vibe Telecaster. How does it compare to the Lite Ash? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevin134 Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 Tele. 1. Teles' don't just do trebly twangy stuff. All the electric on the first Led Zep album is Tele (as is the solo on the studio version of Stairway). You can get some nice chunky rythm sounds out of them too 2. As someone said' date=' you'll probably be happy with the stock pups 3. Fewer feedback issues if you want to do high gain high volume stuff Lots of good rock players gravitated towards Teles later in their careers; Beck, Mick Ronson, Dave Davies... [/quote'] Beck? Later in his career? sorry, couldn't resist, yardbirds and early solo stuff for sure, then occasionally through rest of career. Page used Tele's sporadically from Yardbirds up to the Firm.. As to the original posters question, go with a CV Tele, you mention Burnside, as in RL? I believe he was a Tele guy, and most of the other guys you mention I think are either Tele guys or solid body guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianh Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 CCR: I recently bought both a near-new 2008 factory spec Dot and a virtually unplayed '95 MIM Tele, and they are fairly different in some significant ways. I paid $150 for the Dot (a steal, not normal) and $300 for the Tele, but the Tele came with a case and cheesy amp and I see nice MIMs selling used for $250 frequently. I'd bet if you trolled Craiglisp for a month or so you could get both for under $500. But since you have to use your MF credit: Immediately, you will notice the Dot has a very thick neck which you may not like if you're used to Fenders. The Tele neck is much more comfortable and I can play it for days with no carpal tunnel syndrome. The Dot neck is also slightly wider, so open tunings are easier to play without inadvertently muting the unfretted strings. The Dot pickups are much hotter and I have to turn the amp down if switching from the Tele. They both have a good variety of tones, though the Tele can get more bright. I had to do some surgery on the Dot to get the action down and intonation right. Ultimately, I had to put an Earvana nut on it, and now it plays and sounds pretty great. I don't know if all Dots come that way, or if mine just never got set up properly. I don't have any problems on feedback with either, the Dot has a 2 x4 running the length of the guitar so not really a true hollow-body except in looks. The Tele was easy to set up, no hassle getting the action down low and intonation is good enough not to need to fool with the nut, ever. The Tele will be much easier to upgrade too, since all the electronics are right under the pickguard. On the Dot you have to be a surgeon to put new PUPs and wiring in. I also really like the light weight and compactness of the Tele. It's the Speedo of guitars, you hardly know you have it on. I think if I had to choose just one guitar it would be the Dot for the variety of tones and styles it can accomodate. But if it were just for rythym work, and especially for long sets say, with a funk band, it would be the Tele. One other thing worth mentioning, the Tele is virtually indestructible, doesn't react much to temperature/humidity changes and so is almost always still in tune when I go back to it after few days. That, and it would be great for self-defense in a bar fight. With the Dot you's get one good shot and then...splinters. Let us know how it turns out. Cheers, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ButchCassidy Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 Get what you get, and if it doesn't sound right, or if it gets old, mod the pickups, etc. I think either guitar would be cool though. Here's something to think about: If you get a tele and it's not powerful enough, you can put some hot rail style pickups in it. If you get a dot and the humbuckers aren't giving you the right sound you can try some humbucker sized single coils. I too have an Epi Valve Jr. and Ibanez tube screamer (ts9dx) The perfect Black keys sound for me is: Tele or dot Guitar on neck pickup, vol and tone all up V jr.- 12-3 o'clock Ts9dx- ts9 mode, Drive 3 o'clock, level 12 o'clock, tone 12 o'clock Sounds spot on, at least on my set up to me I always think of RL burnside stuff played with the bridge pickup. Ps- Check out Elmore James' "The Sky is Crying" CD. Pretty cool slide stuff in the same genre. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
layboomo Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 I'd go with the Squier Classic Vibe Tele @ $299 it's hard to beat IMHO. It blows the MIM tele's out of the water for less $. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chewy1281734128 Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 telecaster. its got the good treble and twang, but can get distorted nicely and whack out some power chords and argeggios. the dot is nice looking, but limited for sound. and when played clean its not the best. plus you've got the aspect of the 'muddy' pickups. our rhythm player uses one though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sexygibson Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 I may be going against the grain here but I would recommend the Dot. I don't consider the Tele as a rhythm guitar but I guess it could depend on what you play. I have played mostly in country, southern rock, and blues bands where most of the lead players play Teles and the rhythm guys use Strats or Les Pauls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Summerisle Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 Another vote for the Telecaster, here. I gigged for years with a blond '52 reissue Telecaster as my sole guitar (and sorry Generation Zero, I never took a back-up, other than a spare set of Ernie Ball 9s in my guitar case!) Nothing is a versatile as a Tele. It's like the Swiss Army Knife of guitars. And, as Robbie Robertson once said, if you were so minded you could even hammer nails into the thing and then stand up and gig with it... If this is going to be your main guitar, versatility is where you should be thinking. Great though thin-line semis are, they always sound like what they are...whereas you can coax a lot out of a Telecaster. I don't consider the Tele as a rhythm guitar but I guess it could depend on what you play. I have played mostly in country' date=' southern rock, and blues bands where most of the lead players play Teles[/quote'] Strats can't take the double-stop bends that country players (and the odd blues player) are addicted to - they sound horribly out of tune. I guess country lead players also like the Tele's twangier qualities. I always loved a Tele for blues because Strats sounded (too my ears) too silvery and sweet when played clean. For some reason I presently own a Strat but not a Tele. That situation may yet change... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluelake07 Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 Chuck Berry didnt play a Telecaster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Summerisle Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 But other great rhythm guitarists did: dang it, I'm gassing for a white Telecaster now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron G Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 It's funny because I used to have a kind of negative attitude about Fender guitars - a baseless one formed when I was a beginner back in the 60s. I was a "Gibson man", end of story. When I reentered the world of electrics a couple years ago, I bought a Dot with the same dogma in mind. But since then I have been carefully listening to records and have gained a new and profound respect for the merits of the different sounds of all these wonderful guitars. It's all good! That being said, there is no such thing as a "rhythm guitar". The distinct sounds of Strats, Telecasters and Gibson types each have their own appeal. Play them all and decide what you want out of your next guitar. Oh, and The Boss has played a lot of excellent rhythm on Esquires and Teles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sexygibson Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 It's funny because I used to have a kind of negative attitude about Fender guitars - a baselessone formed when I was a beginner back in the 60s. I was a "Gibson man"' date=' end of story. When I reentered the world of electrics a couple years ago, I bought a Dot with the same dogma in mind. But since then I have been carefully listening to records and have gained a new and profound respect for the merits of the different sounds of all these wonderful guitars. It's all good! That being said, there is no such thing as a "rhythm guitar" the distinct sounds of Strats, Telecasters and Gibson types each have their own appeal. Play them all and decide what [i']you[/i] want out of your next guitar. Oh, and The Boss has played a lot of excellent rhythm on Esquires and Teles. Very good advice from Ron there. Although I've never wanted a Tele for rhythm playing, you just might. Now, I might however be interested in one of those Vintage Vibes for playing some blues lead licks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie brown Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 Wow....as has been stated...2 different animals, really. However, I have managed "Lucille" like tones, from my Telecaster, and quite easily, too. Backed off the tone control, a bit (and sometimes the volume control as well), which tends to take the Tele "Twang" out, and fatten up the tone....and there it was. Played along with B.B.'s "Live At The Regal," and had virtually identical tone. I have never had a DOT or 335 (by itself) sound like a Telecaster, though. So, I guess I would say to go with the Tele. But, they're Both great guitars, and if you have a personal preference for the Dot, and Tele's don't quite "do it" for you, then by all means, get a Dot. You can always adjust the amp, and add a pedal or two, and get close to "Telecaster tone," that way. Oh...I forgot to add, that my Telecaster ("Highway 1 Texas Tele") has had a 4 way switch put in, which gave it one extra (rounder) tone, and was a great "mod," IMHO. So, that may(?) have helped, too. CB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Memphs1978 Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 i have both and honstly the only reason i still have my DOT is b/c i dont have another one like it i love my $90 squire tele and my dot is so so at best.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluelake07 Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 I should note I would consider upping my budget for a casino possibly I just don't know much about P90's and tonal differences from a standard dot./quote] If you can try a Casino in a local store, do it. Wonderful rhythm guitar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gashole Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 Dot vs Tele? Tele Sheraton vs Tele? Depends on the individual guitar 335 vs Tele? Depends again I think most Teles, even lower end, will probably be of a better build quality than a Dot. That's my subjective opinion, I do not state it as fact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duane v Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 A Tele with a CC pup in the neck position would be tough to beat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RenegadeMaster Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 I personally would say a tele is better then a dot, I would say a sheraton is better then a tele, but a deluxe tele is the best, personal opinion :), but as a rhythm guitar, tele all around Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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