Epiphone vs. Gibson overall quality

[todddr]

I'm just getting back in to the world of guitars after 20+ years away. In my youth I played in bands, actually made a bit of a living at it. Played Ibanez guitars mostly; briefly owned a Gibson Les Paul in the mid 1980's. Got it in exchange for some recording work I did--sold it. Wish to heck I'd have kept it.

Anyway, now I notice that epiphone is owned by Gibson. So what's the "truth" regarding the Epiphone Studio LP vs. the Gibson STudio LP?

Cheaper electonics in the Epiphone? Overall lesser quality? I'm seeing conflicting information.

[animalfarm]

This topic has been kicked around the block a number of times!

I owned 3 Gibson Les Pauls in my time, loved 'em. Sold 'em when I

went in Navy. In 2008, I bought an EPI LP Studio as I no longer

had the extra mega-bux to spend on a Gibby. Guess What? I have

NO REGRETS! No quality problems here! Plays like a "real" guitar!

(yuk, yuk, yuk...). [cool]

 

Being a former Gibby owner, I DID grab a set of Gibson pups and Tuners

(see signature line), just my personal preference. Upgrade for each git

ran about $130.00. My total cost - $450.00 per git with upgrades. A Gibby

Studio STARTS at $799.00.

 

Other than fretboard inlays, hard to tell Epi from Gibby. (Yeah, the Headstock,

I know....)

 

[deflepfan]

Well Animal, the new Ltd Ed Studio Deluxe have the inlays!

 

I, too, have the Epi Studio (not the new one), and though I have not been playing for years, I love my Epi Studio. My step son has a Gibson Studio, and we each play the other's guitars. And we each enjoy both guitars. Tim's a bit of a snob, though he won't admit it. Says that though he doesn't regret getting the Gibson, had he played the Epi first, he would have bought it.

 

My Epi Studio is stock, with open coil Alnico Classic p'ups. Tim's Gibson has the Burstbuckers. The two guitars are not the same, but if you can live with not having Gibson on the headstock, the Epi is a great guitar.

 

Here's a pic of the new LTD ED Studio:

 

 

 

And mine!

 

Sheila

[charlie brown]

Todd...Welcome aboard! Hope you'll enjoy your time here....

 

I can't speak, specifically, of about the LP Studio's, but...As with most things, it depends on

the individual guitar(s), really. Some Gibby's have problems, some are fantastic!

Same, in my experience, with Epi's. I own (probably, too many of) both! Love 'em all!

Wouldn't have spent the money, on either, otherwise. And...Epiphone, has been owned by

Gibson, since 1957. Were built in the same USA Kalamazoo, Michigan factory, until Epi was

sent to the Orient, in 1970. The USA-'57-69/70 versions are of equal quality, if slightly

different specs (headstocks, etc.) to the Gibson's, of that time. The Asian versions have had

"ups and downs" in quality, but now (for the most part) seem to be at a good/great quality level,

again. Especially, at their price point! ;>) Some other's may have differing opinions, but I've

had great luck/success, with ALL my Epi's.

 

CB

[Guest]

I have over the last 6 months been planning and putting together a team of 5 guitars I want for my hobby which is studying, learning, playing blues.

 

I have categories to fill hollow, semi hollow, solid body.

 

The three main guitars will be a Zephyr Blues Deluxe, Sheraton and a Firebird which cover the above categories.

 

The Gibson ES5 is way out of my price range, so in my opinion a nice Peerless Zephyr Blues Deluxe is a good option.

 

I would obviously love a Gibson 345 but again way out of my price range, I will have a nice modified Sheraton.

 

However, I nearly pulled the trigger on an Epiphone Firebird with Seymour Duncan minis....the guy wanted 4500 swedish krona.....I done some research and found a Gibson Firebird that I could afford if I saved the 4500 and sold one of my spare hollow bodied guitars, then added a little money.

 

The through body construction of the Gibson Firebird compared to the bolt on necks and set necks of a lot of replica Firebirds made me think this is the "one" Gibson I would like to have the real McCoy of.

 

The Firebird and my Levin will be the two non Asian guitars in my 5.

 

Hope to have it in a few weeks definitley by the summer.

 

I am not really an LP sort of guy but if I was tempted in that area I would check out a Tokai or the J&D LP500 AS90 brought my attention to there seems to be a lot of nice LP options...

[antwhi2001]

Cheaper everything - electronics, wood, hardware, lacquer. Only thing that may be the same spec is the Grover tuners. If you can afford the Gibson, get the Gibson. They hold their value better. If you can't afford the Gibson, the Epis are very good for the money. Combined with a good amp, they are pro standard.

Like a few people here, I'm fortunate to have owned both. I like having a Les Paul in my collection, but it'll never be my main guitar, so I can't justify to myself the cost of a Gibson. The Epi gets its turn at gigs alongside my Gibsons and Fenders.

[alanssaab]

i've compared the sound of my epi std to a gibby studio and there wasn't much in it to my ears , i'm waiting on a wiring kit so that should make a bit of a difference , i'll let you know :) , but i'm very happy with my epi plugged into the old jcm800 :) what a noise

[Hungrycat]

I my experience, (A/B-ing new Gibsons to new Epis and other brands.) quality control of Gibson (RIGHT NOW that is...) is absolute $hit. You have to spend AT LEAST $2000 to get a decent fret job from the factory. A $300 Epi G400 has perfect frets 95 of 100 times.

 

Lets compare the LP standard models shall we?:

The Epiphones are 90% of the sound for 30% of the price. Even if you upgrade everything on it to top of the line, you get 99% of the sound for 45-50% of the price of the Gibby.

 

Not that Gibsons aren't nice, they're just one giant rip-off. They could cut the price by a third and still make a massive profit. It's sheer greed. And I'm throwing my BS flag on it.

[The Beatles Sound]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Noi4moG4oE

[disaster]

I found quality spotty on both Gibsons & Epiphones while shopping. I didn't find much difference in playability & sound between LPs or SGs with either logo. I stopped looking at about the $2500 mark. I couldn't justify that kind of cost for my talents. Play both the Epiphones & Gibsons to see what you like & don't like. I found the necks on the Epiphones were thinner & faster which suited me better. When I found an Epiphone "Custom Shop/Limited Edition" SG it was just what I was looking for. The best quality of the Epiphone/Gibson products I played. Looks like an SG, sounds like an SG, plays like an SG. I'm very pleased with it.

 

If you're searching for an LP style I highly recommend the PRS SE Single Cut & the SE Tremonti guitars. Far superior quality. Far superior playability. Comparable, maybe a little better tone. But they have "Wide/Fat" necks which I didn't care for. You may like it.

 

Good Luck

[tulsaslim]

Coming back after 20 years you will be astounded by the overall improved quality of Asian-made guitars. A modified (upgraded) Epi will be very hard to distinguish from a Gibby sound-wise and certainly not playability-wise, as the Asian-made guitars today play as well as any guitars ever made.

Before you decide let me suggest a Michael Kelly Patriot. Stomps the daylight out of my Epi LPs quality-wise for the same price.

[brianh]

Just for the record, Gibson (Ted McCarty) purchased the Epiphone Company in 1957 for $20,000.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epiphone

http://fans.papervixen.net/gibson/about.php

http://www.epiphone.com/history.asp

[Guest]

Just for the record' date=' Gibson (Ted McCarty) purchased the Epiphone Company in 1957 for $20,000.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epiphone

http://fans.papervixen.net/gibson/about.php

http://www.epiphone.com/history.asp [/quote']

 

Brian thank you so much........I read from the links and with the Epiphone legacy eminating from Sparta in Greece......this means there is only one answer for any Gibson owner who ever derides my beloved Sheraton or Zephyr...........................

 

Everyone who loves their Epiphone say it loud

 

I AM SPARTACUS

 

come on guys be proud of your Epiphone..............(especially you Hector Arcadius.....:) )

 

[YOUTUBE]

[/YOUTUBE]

[ant7629]

I own three Gibsons, and they are great. I hope I never have to part with them. That said, in each instance I had try a few problematic Gibsons to find the one I bought. And each one needed a set up from a luthier.

 

I can say the same for the Epiphones I own/have owned. Some are great, some have real problems. But heres the thing, for me Epiphone holds a certain "je ne sais quoi" that Gibson doesn't have. Maybe its because they seem to be regarded as the underdog or because they have really cool features that make certain models stand out. I don't know if anyone else gets what I am saying, but they do seem to just have that vibe about them.

 

Going back to build quality, I recently purchased a Chinese made Riviera and haven't been so impressed with a new guitar for a LONG time. Right out of the box, all I did was lower the bridges a little. Plays/sounds wonderful. Before now, I had been put off the Chinese made Epiphones by many who say they are not as good as the ones made in Korea. This has certainly opened my eyes.

 

I don't own a LP Studio, but I would definitely check out both the Gibson and Epiphone version before you try.

 

Good luck

[todddr]

I appreciate everyone's feedback. After reading a few responses I thought, well, I'm just going down to Guitar Center Saturday and getting a Gibson, Studio or Standard. Then after a few more posts, I felt like, "hell, if I buy a Gibson I'm getting taken for the sake of a name." So I'll just pick up a nice Epi.

In the end, as also noted in a post, I guess I just have to go play'em--all of them. I troubled for weeks over my last acoustic guitar purchase--guess the effort for an electric might as well be similar.

Thanks again to all for the posts.

[colchar]

If you are willing to consider an SG, the Epiphone G-400 is a great guitar for the money.

[midiman56]

I guess I just have to go play'em--all of them. I troubled for weeks over my last acoustic guitar purchase--guess the effort for an electric might as well be similar.

 

You just hit the nail squarely on the head, Toddr! All the reviews and opinions in the world aren't going to tell your ears what they hear and your fingers what they feel.

 

I personally own six Epiphone guitars, two of which are Les Paul models. I've been earning a living with one of them for over a year now and I think they are both fantastic guitars. I just recently purchased a Gibson Les Paul Traditional Pro ... my first Gibby in well over 25 years. I am here to tell you that the ARE different! Now, whether that difference is real or psychological, or whether that difference is worth the sizeable jump in price is the question ... especially since you could practically take home the LP Studio AND the G400 if you go with Epiphone!

 

Good luck with your decision and try to have some fun with the process!

 

Jim

[bloozeguy]

I have over the last 6 months been planning and putting together a team of 5 guitars I want for my hobby which is studying' date=' learning, playing blues.

 

I have categories to fill hollow, semi hollow, solid body.

 

The three main guitars will be a Zephyr Blues Deluxe, Sheraton and a Firebird which cover the above categories.

 

The Gibson ES5 is way out of my price range, so in my opinion a nice Peerless Zephyr Blues Deluxe is a good option.

 

I would obviously love a Gibson 345 but again way out of my price range, I will have a nice modified Sheraton.

 

However, I nearly pulled the trigger on an Epiphone Firebird with Seymour Duncan minis....the guy wanted 4500 swedish krona.....I done some research and found a Gibson Firebird that I could afford if I saved the 4500 and sold one of my spare hollow bodied guitars, then added a little money.

 

The through body construction of the Gibson Firebird compared to the bolt on necks and set necks of a lot of replica Firebirds made me think this is the "one" Gibson I would like to have the real McCoy of.

 

The Firebird and my Levin will be the two non Asian guitars in my 5.

 

Hope to have it in a few weeks definitley by the summer.

 

I am not really an LP sort of guy but if I was tempted in that area I would check out a Tokai or the J&D LP500 AS90 brought my attention to there seems to be a lot of nice LP options...

 

 

 

[/quote']

Hey, Joe! (not song title!),

Just wondering--in your study of the blues, ae you doing anything acoustic, ala The Various Johnsons, Lemon Jefferson, Son House, Bukka, etc.? What are you using for these?

[matiac]

People can say whatever they want, my Epiphone Les Paul Classic Quilt Top in transparent blue is every bit the guitar as ANY of the Gibsons (3 total) I had the privilege to own, even stock-out-of-the-box. It's got the weight, the bling, the tone, the playability. Yeah, the wood may be different, but I don't care. It's a Les Paul as far as I'm concerned.

[charlie brown]

Yeah....the guitar is only as good/useful (regardless of brand), as the player, playing it! Otherwise,

it's just wood, plastic, and metal....as nice as it may be, "put together."

 

CB

[animalfarm]

Matiac, and ChrarleiBrown - +10 to your resonses!

The wood is only as good as the player. bottom line:

"Let the Music Do The Talkin" = Aerosmith.

 

Gimme a break, the EPIs are as GOOD as the GIBBYS,

If you play poorly on an Epi, you'll also do same on a Gibby.

I believe the Gibbys may have a slightly thinner neck than the

Epis, but HEY - 60's "Fat Necks" are also cool - the hands adjust

rather quickly.

I play my EPI Classic more often than my EPI Studio due to the

"thinner/Faster neck", but will GIG with either one as my brain

(what's left of it) adjusts within seconds of kicking off a tune.

 

Let the music do the Talking - Either you can play or not. Owning a

Gibson is real "Mind Candy", but if you DO own a gibby, you'd better be able

to produce....

 

BTW- as my Avatar shows, my dog CAN howl in key to lots of

Lynyrd Skynyrd tunes....

[Guest]

Hey' date=' Joe! (not song title!),

Just wondering--in your study of the blues, ae you doing anything acoustic, ala The Various Johnsons, Lemon Jefferson, Son House, Bukka, etc.? What are you using for these?

[/quote']

 

Bloozeguy

 

I currently have this has my acoustic.....1959 Levin 335

 

 

This is me 9.30am testing it out (hence a little stiff) just after I bought it...

 

 

The Levins are nice for the type of blues you are referring to

 

I really would like a Levin Model 27 "Texas". I have found a few but they had issues with age, hard to find one with a good neck... Will keep looking though and the small Levin parlour guitars are also great for the styles you mentioned.

 

here is the Levin Texas

 

[YOUTUBE]

[/YOUTUBE]

 

and Levin Parlour guitars

 

[YOUTUBE]

[/YOUTUBE]

 

Paid US$550 for my Levin 335

 

You can find a "Texas" or "Parlour" for around US$140 to US$240

 

So yes is the answer to your question

 

My Five Blues Guitars as the stand now

 

1) Epiphone Zephyr Blues Deluxe (deal is done I pick it up on the 19th of this month)

2) Epiphone "Epiphone by Gibson" Sheraton (Modded Pickups and Harness being shipped to me as I write)

3) Gibson Firebird V VS (struck a deal with a supplier should have it by June)

4) Levin 335

5) Samick SG (going to use this guitar as a test bed t try out some pickups, but will eventually go and make way for a keeper but cannot make my mind up about what that guitar will be could be a Levin Texas, Riviera, Gold Top or something else with 2 Soapbar P90's, Tele, Strat, Les Paul SG, Airline, I have not made my mind up yet....what I would love is if my local town someone would open up a "Guitar Library" so I could hire one of the above out every month......

 

I can only have 5 in the house........It is a deal I made with myself and my wife and kids in the new house we are building. I will share an office and There will be storage for 5 guitars, two amps.......Well you know the story.....

[BKitten]

No appreciable difference that I have noticed, in terms of stuff that actually makes a real difference in the real world.

 

The Epiphone build quality is up and down - I've seen some great ones, and some awful ones, including an arctic LP Custom where the binding looked broken and hastily patched back together and then polyed over the top. I hasten to add that it played fine! I've also seem some really great and really poo Gibsons, the last BFG I saw recently in a store looked laughable like it was about to fall apart at any moment, I was almost afraid to even pick it up... their higher end guitars have wonky problems too sometimes. Human error, it can happen to any guitar manufacturer.

 

As for woods used on an Epi electric guitar vs a Gibson, no-one has ever been able to accurately quantify the difference it makes. People will use hazy, non-specific, emotion-laden terms like "warm", "bright", "resonant", "creamy" etc... but no-one I'm aware of ever actually gotten out and done an A-B and measured the actual frequency differences or anything like that, preferring to leave these things to quasi-religious mystique. Even if there are differences, it's highly subjective as to what is "better". Remember that the Fender Jazzmasters were highly regarded by "surf rock" guitarists because they didn't sustain all that well. There's no such thing as a consensus on "ideal tone", but there certainly is a consensus on "bad playing". One of my beginner guitar students owns a Gibson Les Paul Studio, I usually teach him with either my Epiphone Emily SG, or my Epiphone Wildkat. Guess which player has the better "tone"? The difference is that I've been playing for 23 years, he's been playing for about 23 days. When I pick up his guitar and play it, it does feel like a quality instrument (the psychology of "gosh I'm holding something really expensive" probably helps give that impression), but I don't think I actually sound any better at all than with my bolt-on G-310 Emily that cost about 1/10th of the price. Is it a different sound? Yeah, slightly. Is it a better sound? Not really, just different. He doesn't sound any better (or worse) with my guitars either.

 

The instruments do feel different, however. I despise Gibson SGs because I hate the fat necks on them, the Epis seem to have slightly thinner necks. Les Pauls are more similar, they feel different but if you blindfolded me and put an LP Studio in my hand, I wouldn't know if it was a Gibson or Epi unless I felt the headstock or the tuners... and I hate Klusons, the Grovers on the high-end Epis are so much blingier and easier to turn and they're less spiky which means if I accidentally hit someone with my headstock it's less likely to cut them.

 

If you're shopping the only advice I can give is pick it up, plug it in, make sure it feels good and it's the sound you want. Ignore what's on the headstock, that only matters for resale value and bragging rights. Gibsons have a downside too - you're more likely to be robbed for them, or have them stolen after gigs. I live in a high-crime area and so I'm conscious of not showing off anything that's too expensive...

[Red 333]

Excellent post, BKitten. Lots for all of to think about, no matter what side of the fence you are one.

 

As for me, I don't like to use words like "better" (though it's hard to avoid). As BK and others have pointed out, one guitar may sound different from another, and that's what you may prefer. Since are few ways to evaluate an instrument objectively (the way you can with how fast a car goes from 0 to 60, for instance, or how much THD there is an a home stereo amp), there's little use using saying these pick ups or this guitar sounds better, unless it's followed by "to me, in my opinion." And when you hear someone say that, you have to understand that it's implied.

 

I have a lot of Gibsons and Epiphones, and appreciate each on their own merits. I prefer Gibsons in many cases, often because of how they sound to me, but especially as objects to look at admire. By design, they are manufactured so that they can sold for more money, so they are made with grades of wood and types of finishes that I find more attractive. I enjoy and appreciate this aspect of ownership. It's like choosing between two coffee tables. One may be a smartly designed, but budget example from Ikea, while another might be a fine peice of expensive craftsmanship from a local cabinet maker. Both will hold my coffee and magazine just fine, but I might prefer the more costly one over the Ikea product beacuse it just looks better to me in the living room.

 

Here's another thought about the wood. Epiphone does a lot of things different from Gibson in order to manufacture a guitar that can be sold at such an affordable price point. One of those things is the wood selection. It's well known that certain types and grades of wood having more desirable acoustic properties. It's also been demonstrated that in the right hands, and given enough time, a highly skilled luthier could probably make a great sounding instrument out of just about anything. But, you can practically gurantee you are going to get different (what some would say are inferior results) when you use budget wood and spend less time working with it.

 

In manufacturing, time is money. If you're going to sell them for less, but better be able to make them faster. And, to sell them for less, you're going to also have to use that lower cost wood we talked about. Oh, and big pieces (which will resonate better than several smaller ones put together)? They cost more, so you're going to have use pieces here and there.

 

If you spend less time spent building a guitar that has a greater number of pieces, there's a risk that the joinery is less precise. That, too, results in a less resonant, maybe less pleasing sounding instrument than a corresponding design made with fewer pieces over more time, with wood that may naturally resonate better, as a rule, in the first place.

 

So, there's a daisy chain effect that practically guarantees that, as a rule, an Epiphone is going to sound somewhat different than a similar looking Gibson. And, because so many are made so fast, a few duff ones will likely get out the door on top of it. But, a well-made one will probably sound pretty darn good, and the difference in sound and appearance (and for some, prestige) between it and a Gibson may not be justifiable to you.

 

Epi makes some fine instruments. Twenty years or so ago, you might have had to appologize for owning one. I don't think you should have to in today's day and age.

 

Red 333

[TP]

Hey' date=' Joe! (not song title!),

Just wondering--in your study of the blues, ae you doing anything acoustic, ala The Various Johnsons, Lemon Jefferson, Son House, Bukka, etc.? What are you using for these?

[/quote']

 

Hi bloozeguy.... Love all of those blues guys! I am more of an acoustic player than an electric player but I loves me some blues!

 

I have 3 acoustics and all work fine for blues, but in reality, if I am going to go do some acoustic blues, the only guitar I want in my hands is my 1964 Gibson LG1. The ladder bracing of the top is what gives it the perfect blues tone. No X braced guitar is going to sound as true to the original players as a nice old ladder braced box.

 

I am like Joe in that 5 guitars does it for me, but that is 3 acoustics and 2 electrics. All 3 acoustics have pickups in them so I can play out anywhere and not have to worry about volume, especially since my LG1 can be lost in an acousitic or electric mix quickly, again due to the ladder bracing.

 

Here is my most special Acoustic Blues machine....