Gibson "Factory Seconds"??

[trapdoorspider]

How can you tell if you are buying a Gibson "factory second" or refurbished guitar? Does Gibson mark them in some way, like they do with Epiphones? Several sellers on eBay offer "brand-new" Les Pauls and SGs and insist they are not "factory seconds." Well, how can I tell?

[Tim Plains]

Contact Gibson and they will tell you they stopped selling seconds, or B-stock, in 1985.

Before '85, they'd have a 2 stamped in the back of the headstock.

What you should do is to get the serial number, email it to Gibson and ask for the guitar's model number.

A desertburst Les Paul Standard's model number will look like this: LP5+DBNH1

That 1 on the end means it's not B-stock. If it's a 2, it's B-stock.

[Custom....]

wow R9 you certianly have some indepth answers.

[Tim Plains]

I try...

[Flight959]

Contact Gibson and they will tell you they stopped selling seconds' date=' or B-stock, in 1985.

Before '85, they'd have a 2 stamped in the back of the headstock.

What you should do is to get the serial number, email it to Gibson and ask for the guitar's model number.

A desertburst Les Paul Standard's model number will look like this: LP5+DBNH1

That 1 on the end means it's not B-stock. If it's a 2, it's B-stock.[/quote']

 

Gibson stopped "stamping" seconds in 85... Alot of guitars still come out of the factory today with flaws however they just dont declare or sell it as a second anymore..

 

Flight959

[MikeRom]

 

Gibson stopped "stamping" seconds in 85... Alot of guitars still come out of the factory today with flaws however they just dont declare or sell it as a second anymore..

 

Flight959

 

 

 

[Tim Plains]

Gibson stopped "stamping" seconds in 85... Alot of guitars still come out of the factory today with flaws however they just dont declare or sell it as a second anymore..

Fair enough' date=' but what do you consider a factory second? Minor issues that don't affect how the guitar plays or sounds...like the binding around a few frets not being perfect? One of the side markers on my Custom doesn't line up perfectly with the rest of them...is the guitar B-stock? The first LP I almost bought had a small black mark on the back of the neck...B-stock? Does a misaligned pickup make a guitar B-stock? My answer to all of the above is no.

 

B-stock mean's there is a serious issue with the guitar that most likely cannot be corrected. These minor things that some people complain about are not serious issues. They buy a Gibson and expect absolute perfection....unfortunately, that's not always possible. The binding isn't perfect...the finish isn't perfect...don't buy the frick'n guitar! Problem solved.

 

If guitars were things that you purchased and hung on your wall behind a piece of glass, then yeah...I could see the need for absolute perfection.

 

Have you ever seen an image of a Gibson employee feeding a brand new Les Paul to a ban saw? That's B-stock.

[t.a.f.k.a.i.]

i heard that if the top isnt perfect , they just spray them gold .

 

[SRV-Zeppelin]

i heard that if the top isnt perfect ' date=' they just spray them gold .

 

[/quote']

 

Ooh... ouch!

 

By the way... shouldn't your signature read, "The Artist FORMERLY Known as Ian?"

[t.a.f.k.a.i.]

THANKS

[SRV-Zeppelin]

Much better!

[SRV-Zeppelin]

Nice goldtop by the way... that must be a b-stock R6, eh?

[t.a.f.k.a.i.]

i believe so

[Thundergod]

 

Gibson stopped "stamping" seconds in 85... Alot of guitars still come out of the factory today with flaws however they just dont declare or sell it as a second anymore..

 

Flight959

 

 

 

 

Why would they? Almost 75% of the production gets dented at GC by stupid a-holes anyway.

[britabe]

MF has scratch n dent traditionals...i assume its because these said a*&holes at MF scratched and dented them at the store

color me confused...

[trapdoorspider]

Thanks, Gents. Yeah, I was wondering because I bought a brand-new 2008 Les Paul Studio as a store-liquidation, and it just seemed to have more cosmetic issues than my other Gibsons, so I was wondering if this was a second or something. For one thing, there's a definite slight "ridge" you can feel along the fretboard/neck seam. It's all glued down nicely (no gaps or cracks in the paint or finish), but it's almost like they didn't make the fretboard wide enough. I've never had a Studio, but you can't feel that on any of my SGs (I have 12 of them).

[Flight959]

Some more useful info with markings I have never seen before..

 

Gibson often marked inferior quality guitars as "seconds", and sold them at a discount to dealers or employees. These markings were stamped into the wood on the back of the peghead. A "2" stamp is sometimes seen, designating a "second", which had some cosmetic flaw. If there is a serial number on the back of the peghead, the "2" is usually seen centered above or below it. Also sometimes stamped was "CULL", which is another designation of a second. Again, this stamp is seen on the back of the peghead. The worse Gibson reject is the "BGN" stamp, designating that instrument as a "bargin" guitar. These were only sold to employees at substantial discounts. This stamp is also seen on the back of the peghead. Sometimes the "BGN" is stamped vertically with the "N" below the "G" which is below the "B". BGN instruments weren't acceptable to Gibson as sellable to the public.

All second instruments are usually worth less than the same guitar that is not a second (given condition as the same). BGN instruments are worth less than a second instrument because these tend to have some fairly serious cosmetic flaw.

 

Taken from the internet...

 

Flight959

[Hooch]

I was told this is a gibson but have been told it's not.  Any idea what it might be.  It has no markings or numbers 

[01GT eibach]

19 minutes ago, Hooch said:

I was told this is a Gibson but have been told it's not.  Any idea what it might be.  It has no markings or numbers 

It is not even a Gibson second.  At best it is a Gibson sixth ... maybe even a seventh ...

[MADCLAPPER]

2 hours ago, Hooch said:

I was told this is a gibson but have been told it's not.  Any idea what it might be.  It has no markings or numbers 

Who told you that? and mo' importantly,  do you believe them ?

You should not need to ask, with a headstock like that? LOL ! itssa POS ! AKA Firewood.

[Eracer_Team]

5 hours ago, Hooch said:

I was told this is a gibson but have been told it's not.  Any idea what it might be.  It has no markings or numbers 

 

Not sure why you'd resurrect such an old post (2008) in stead of starting a new one.

Right headstock looks like someone cutdown the old headstock to "resemble" a Gibson.

Body is wrong shape too.

And what's with the 10 deg twist with the bridge pickup.

I'd put a guitar like this in my trunk, for lunch time practice cause it will make guitar sounds, and I wouldn't worry about heat, cold, freezing,  rain hurting it

[deeman]

Is it just the picture or is that fredboard like a mile wide?

 

I guess if you like the guitar and it plays well and sounds good to you, great but I hope you didn't pay more than 50 bucks for it. :)

[Navy Vet.]

On ‎12‎/‎4‎/‎2008 at 4:19 AM, Tim Plains said:

Fair enough' date=' but what do you consider a factory second? Minor issues that don't affect how the guitar plays or sounds...like the binding around a few frets not being perfect? One of the side markers on my Custom doesn't line up perfectly with the rest of them...is the guitar B-stock? The first LP I almost bought had a small black mark on the back of the neck...B-stock? Does a misaligned pickup make a guitar B-stock? My answer to all of the above is no.

 

B-stock mean's there is a serious issue with the guitar that most likely cannot be corrected. These minor things that some people complain about are not serious issues. They buy a Gibson and expect absolute perfection....unfortunately, that's not always possible. The binding isn't perfect...the finish isn't perfect...don't buy the frick'n guitar! Problem solved.

 

If guitars were things that you purchased and hung on your wall behind a piece of glass, then yeah...I could see the need for absolute perfection.

 

Have you ever seen an image of a Gibson employee feeding a brand new Les Paul to a ban saw? That's B-stock.

During my 65 years on this planet I have yet to see or play the perfect guitar. They don't exist. And I wouldn't want one because I would agonize over every ding, scratch that a guitar acquires when played. Tone wise,  I would say the tone in your head that every guitarist chases looking for the "Holy Grail" guitar is a myth. There isn't a "Holy Grail" guitar and there will never be one. Every guitar has their own personality and you get to know that personality and you play it accordingly. Gibson seems to get bashed on a regular basis because they don't produce the "perfect guitar." If somebody has a constant gripe about a particular manufacture why do they continue to buy their guitars?

[Big Bill]

1 hour ago, deeman said:

Is it just the picture or is that fredboard like a mile wide?

 

It's a Chibson  Sitar Paul!!

[Navy Vet.]

1 minute ago, Big Bill said:

It's a Chibson  Sitar Paul!!

I didn't notice the fretboard, I've driven interstate highways that weren't that wide.