What lessons have we learned in the past three years?

[saturn]

When I thought they shut this place down, I was convinced it was this thread that was the final straw. 

[Whitefang]

I don't think they'd shut down the whole site over one thread.  If anything they would have ditched the thread.   Surprised it wasn't done days ago.  

Whitefang

[zigzag]

On 4/11/2022 at 8:06 PM, saturn said:

When I thought they shut this place down, I was convinced it was this thread that was the final straw. 

I was kinda hoping they had. This place is a sewer. Was hoping it might change. Not gonna, it appears.

[badbluesplayer]

On 4/12/2022 at 11:43 PM, zigzag said:

I was kinda hoping they had. This place is a sewer. Was hoping it might change. Not gonna, it appears.

Nice delivery.  I'll be your setup man any day!  😁

[mihcmac]

I was really sad that this space might be gone, such a wealth of information and people.

Edited April 16, 2022 by mihcmac

[saturn]

Yeah.  I disagree with the statement that this place is a sewer. I would be sad if they shut it down over a few disagreements. Overall people here are great and I've learned a lot over the years. 

[badbluesplayer]

This place IS great.  That's why it's an attractive place for disaffected people.  It's a captive audience.  People can just run their mouths with no real personal responsibility.  It's easy to get a rise out of people when it's a neutral place by definition but a poster can just interject some divisive political statement.  What are you supposed to do with that stuff?

One side of the political spectrum is permanently disaffected and just run their mouths.  They have leaders and followers. Followers tend to be kept disaffected.  The other side runs hot and cold like a bad marriage.  They pick their priorities from a ticket tumbler.  They're not permanently anything, and they're not always busy being mad at somebody.

All of the hard lib types are through arguing on here.  There used to be a bunch of them, but they're probably just over it.  The cons are still grinding the same axes.  I'm independent and I'll make fun of all of them.

It's a hard thing to try to stay happy and always be hating on somebody.   My hard right friends are getting more and more isolated.

My lib friends are still kind of the same people.  More independent and diverse.

The other problem you con axe grinders have is that you're not what Gibson is trying to appeal to.  You guys are the opposite of that.  So maybe keep that in mind.

[Whitefang]

I think these guys said it best-----

  Whitefang

[jaxson50]

I'll raise you 

Amend the verse, but when you start burning down our cities, attack our police, burn our court houses while waving signs of Che and Mao and demanding an end to our nation, you aint gonna make it with anyone wjth more than one functioning brain cell anyhow. 

[SteveFord]

I'm more worried about Jewish Space Lasers causing damage to the nitro finish on my Les Paul Standard or maybe Ukranian people bombing themselves into submission to make Russia look bad.

[fortyearspickn]

5 hours ago, SteveFord said:

I'm more worried about Jewish Space Lasers causing damage to the nitro finish on my Les Paul Standard or maybe Ukranian people bombing themselves into submission to make Russia look bad.

Of course, some folks could take those two completely sarcastic, humorous attempts to pour oil on the waters and make them political.    I agree with your comment completely - I'm more worried about both those things (substitute J45 for LPs) than the opinions some here hold - WHEN  they hold them in check.       I come here for the sarcasm and irony - thanks for the sarcasm !   Got the irony earlier.      I'm sure we can all agree we do not come here for actual conflict and divisiveness though.   

[badbluesplayer]

2 hours ago, fortyearspickn said:

Of course, some folks could take those two completely sarcastic, humorous attempts to pour oil on the waters and make them political.    I agree with your comment completely - I'm more worried about both those things (substitute J45 for LPs) than the opinions some here hold - WHEN  they hold them in check.       I come here for the sarcasm and irony - thanks for the sarcasm !   Got the irony earlier.      I'm sure we can all agree we do not come here for actual conflict and divisiveness though.   

You're just running your mouth.

Edited April 18, 2022 by badbluesplayer

[Whitefang]

Meanwhile you might have heard or noticed that back in April 4th ANOTHER police officer killed ANOTHER unarmed black man in grand Rapids, Michigan.

Body cam footage and other witness video footage showed the man clearly threatened the officer's life by RUNNING AWAY from him. After the officer tackled him to the ground and while lying on top of him the officer pulled out his service pistol and shot him in the back of the head.  

Of course, NO reason to get upset and protest, right?  

Whitefang

[Whitefang]

Just now, ghost_of_fl said:

If it were a black officer and a white guy running, you probably wouldn't have even heard about it.  

Will have to wait until that sort of thing happens before making that assumption.

That this is most often the case,  it's what gets reported.  And besides, would you really want news services and reporters NOT to give the full story? 

Whitefang

[Sgt. Pepper]

We learned you can slap a guy on National TV, and then 2 minutes later win an award. Isn’t that what being rich and famous is all about? 
What would they have given him if he landed a right uppercut, and did he float like a butterfly and sting like a bee when he slapped him?

Edited April 18, 2022 by Sgt. Pepper

[jaxson50]

I find it a bit disingenuous when the only cell phone videos that go viral are of bad situations.  So many people are basing opinions on such limited and bias information that is intentionally skewed to produce the desired reaction. 

Sadly, they don't even realize they are being played.  There are literally thousands of interactions between police and citizens daily,  out of all of those interactions all that goes viral are the ones that go south.  The narrative then becomes, all interactions between officers and citizens are bad.  Which is ludicrous, slanderous and disingenuous. Purposely so. And it isn't just and American problem, 

 

[zigzag]

Scab pickers. 

Hurray for our side...  like we all hold the moral high ground. I might enjoy this web site a lot more if we didn't spend so much time talking politics, until I realize that most of you don't have much else to say. All of you whiners are victims of the government, or the media, or someone you think wants to take away your rights, or someone who makes a choice you disagree with. Stop being victims. No one wants to be judged by you or me, and quite frankly, I don't really want to judge others. Free thinkers? You're prisoners of your hate and distrust. Rebels?  Hardly. You're simply on the wrong side of history. Build up, stop tearing down.

This USED to be a cool place to come and talk guitars. Now that we've beat that into the ground, there's nothing left but politics. I'm sure that Gibson would prefer that their image did not include politics and radicalism. Henry J. is gone. We're now in the worlds of Levis and Converse... and damned fine guitars.

 

Edited April 18, 2022 by zigzag

[mihcmac]

Paranoia strikes deep
Into your life it will creep
It starts when you're always afraid
You step out of line
The man come and take you away

* the point being, it has always been moral responsibility of artists to get people to mouth the words of what is wrong.

….and what’s good.

Edited April 19, 2022 by mihcmac

[jaxson50]

1 hour ago, zigzag said:

Scab pickers. 

Hurray for our side...  like we all hold the moral high ground. I might enjoy this web site a lot more if we didn't spend so much time talking politics, until I realize that most of you don't have much else to say. All of you whiners are victims of the government, or the media, or someone you think wants to take away your rights, or someone who makes a choice you disagree with. Stop being victims. No one wants to be judged by you or me, and quite frankly, I don't really want to judge others. Free thinkers? You're prisoners of your hate and distrust. Rebels?  Hardly. You're simply on the wrong side of history. Build up, stop tearing down.

This USED to be a cool place to come and talk guitars. Now that we've beat that into the ground, there's nothing left but politics. I'm sure that Gibson would prefer that their image did not include politics and radicalism. Henry J. is gone. We're now in the worlds of Levis and Converse... and damned fine guitars.

 

When I started this thread I intended it to be strictly what the title defected, lessons learned during the past three years. Not necessarily related to political angst but more broadly speaking,  economic impact of Covid19,, the resulting supply chain failures. 

But once someone  ( it doesn't matter who) made it about BLM and the rest of the alphabet soup of ancromins the conversation followed that path.

So to that end, IMO we need to rethink the forty or more years of ever increasing globalisation,  supply chains are vulnerable to the shifts in regional politics ( witness the Ukraine situation with Putin holding Europe's energy needs hostage while he invaded a sovereign nation, and now threatens Finland and Sweden) . 

Lesson 1,  don't do exclusive deals with traditional enemies of liberty such as China and Russia. 

Lesson 2.  Every nation must develop domestic energy as best they can. 

The western nations went into the global economy movement completely naive thinking that trading with authoritarian nations would soften their resolve or somehow by making all nation dependant on each other for goods, the world would be a safer place. Clearly the western nations ( the EU, the US, Canada etc. ) miscalculated. 

 

 

[zigzag]

42 minutes ago, jaxson50 said:

When I started this thread I intended it to be strictly what the title defected, lessons learned during the past three years. Not necessarily related to political angst but more broadly speaking,  economic impact of Covid19,, the resulting supply chain failures. 

Lesson 1,  don't do exclusive deals with traditional enemies of liberty such as China and Russia. 

Lesson 2.  Every nation must develop domestic energy as best they can. 

Well, it is interesting that European car manufacturers are moving toward producing more battery powered vehicles, not due to climate change, but because of their dependence on Russian oil. Monetary and supply issues have necessitated change; not the existential threat to humans.

Energy independence is a bad joke. The US exports much of the oil it processes into fuel oil. Fuel oil is usually in the top three of all US exports. The money grubbers don't tell us that we need to reduce consumption, because it negatively affects their bottom line.  "Conservationists" are pushing renewables as a viable alternative, which is even worse. It seems nuclear power is THE most critical part of the equation, at this point, along with other less effective alternatives.

Oh, sh!te. Look at me. Getting political. Apologies.

Edit: And one more thing. The American consumer has been spoiled. We need to consume less and consume smarter. China has provided a source of inexpensive goods that most all of us happily purchase. And of course, we all love bright and shiny, whether we need it or not, esp. when it's cheap.

Edited April 18, 2022 by zigzag

[fortyearspickn]

11 hours ago, Whitefang said:

Meanwhile you might have heard or noticed that back in April 4th ANOTHER police officer killed ANOTHER unarmed black man in grand Rapids, Michigan.

Body cam footage and other witness video footage showed the man clearly threatened the officer's life by RUNNING AWAY from him. After the officer tackled him to the ground and while lying on top of him the officer pulled out his service pistol and shot him in the back of the head.  

Of course, NO reason to get upset and protest, right?  

Whitefang

Oh.  I thought you were going to say  "Here's another case of a black man resisting arrest and taking an officer's Stun Gun."   We must listen to different radio stations. 

[zigzag]

2 hours ago, fortyearspickn said:

Oh.  I thought you were going to say  "Here's another case of a black man resisting arrest and taking an officer's Stun Gun."   We must listen to different radio stations. 

Well, your radio station would not have been reporting the actual events, d!ckhead. The police officer was not attempting to arrest the victim. The victim was not responding to the officer's requests,  an altercation began when the victim did not respond to the officer's demands to get back in the car, the victim ran, the officer caught him, took him to the ground, told him to get his hands behind his back, then the officer attempted to use his taser on the man, and when it didn't work, he shot him in the back of the head. Another situation where the situation escalated when the "suspect" did not respond to the officer to his liking. 

There has to be a better way of handling these situations, but I'll be damned if I know what it is. Obviously, it might have been far better if the victim had done what the officer asked. In this case, the victim was a refugee from the DR of Congo, and this may have, in some way, affected his actions. A shame someone has to die when the situation might have been handled differently. 

I don't think we know if the car was stolen, since the plates did not match the car's description. But now, another unarmed man is dead, and he was also black.  Go figure. Jeezz, I'm getting sick of this sh!te.

Edited April 19, 2022 by zigzag

[fortyearspickn]

On 4/12/2022 at 10:43 PM, zigzag said:

I was kinda hoping they had. This place is a sewer. Was hoping it might change. Not gonna, it appears.

Most people who think a forum is a sewer and wish it were shut down - don't keep coming back to fuel the flames. 

[zigzag]

15 minutes ago, fortyearspickn said:

Most people who think a forum is a sewer and wish it were shut down - don't keep coming back to fuel the flames. 

Oh you do fine fueling the flames all by yourself. But your point is valid. I keep hoping for a ban.

[zigzag]

13 minutes ago, ghost_of_fl said:

Pretty civil conversation until you checked in. 😒

There is very little that is civll about this conversation.