jaxson50 Posted June 27, 2020 Author Share Posted June 27, 2020 7 hours ago, ghost_of_fl said: Oh specifically people who were 21 years old during the 1960s? I guess I'm missing the point of a comparison that is that specific. Sort a broad base Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larsongs Posted June 27, 2020 Share Posted June 27, 2020 Greatest = Subjective Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merciful-evans Posted June 27, 2020 Share Posted June 27, 2020 17 hours ago, ghost_of_fl said: So is Broadway music. In one score you might be playing a country song one minute and opera the next. Then swing, rock and straight jazz. Try playing the "Guitar 1" part of the musical "Rent" real-time. Just as complex and demanding. You will be frantically juggling at least 3 guitars. But that doesn't make it great. Well I might try playing it if I could find it. Tried for 5 minutes. Got a link? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt. Pepper Posted June 27, 2020 Share Posted June 27, 2020 12 hours ago, ghost_of_fl said: Awww didn't mean to damage your fragile masculinity. Mah bad. 😢 Back to tiddys and beer. Coming from the guy who posted his love of Broadway show tunes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merciful-evans Posted June 27, 2020 Share Posted June 27, 2020 11 minutes ago, ghost_of_fl said: A few things working against you: 1. The show is almost 25 years old 2. The guy that wrote it died before the debut performance 3. MTI flags everything posted on YouTube for copyright 4. You aren't very good at web searches ok so no link then... Can you at least tell me where the guitar part is? Or do I have to sift through the whole 2.15 hrs of it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merciful-evans Posted June 27, 2020 Share Posted June 27, 2020 3 hours ago, ghost_of_fl said: It's over 2.15. Ok let me splain what people do on YouTube. People on YouTube will post copyrighted material they don't own and try to monetize it (make money off of it). Since YouTube had bots that automatically scan for copyrighted material, the people posting will change the content to slip past filters. One way is changing the speed (and thus the pitch) of the recording. Another is editing large parts out and rearranging tracks. You won't find a proper copy of Rent on YouTube. Just little clips. Usually the "big" songs. But in the actual show, there is music almost constantly. In between scenes music. The complexity comes from playing that constant stream of music live and real-time. Not picking one song that has a lot of guitar in it and learning that one. Rent was just an example. Try Ragtime. Or West Side Story. MTI will sell you the score, you don't need a recording if you can read music. 2 things to remember: 1. You don't get to stop and try again when your playing in a Broadway pit. 2. You should really cram yourself into a small space for the full experience. Don't think you get to spread your equipment out and be comfortable. You're just the hired help and you will sit where they tell you to sit. Welcome to Broadway. Thanks for the help/advice/info. Never mind about the tune. I think I get the picture with the West Side Story example. In which case its quite different from the point I was making anyway, which was about improvisation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zigzag Posted June 27, 2020 Share Posted June 27, 2020 Back to the OP. There is no doubt Benson is extremely talented, and even though he had some great albums and some great tunes, he just never did it for me. Too slick, commercial and pretty? Maybe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retired Posted June 28, 2020 Share Posted June 28, 2020 On 6/26/2020 at 10:45 AM, jaxson50 said: Let's not go down that rat hole again. The video clip is a time capsule, show me a video time capsule of a 21 year old doing better.... Jimi Hendrix was what, 27 when he died? Got out of the army in 59 and played backup for greats like BB King, Muddy Waters and so on. My wife has always loved Benson though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaxson50 Posted June 28, 2020 Author Share Posted June 28, 2020 2 hours ago, Retired said: Jimi Hendrix was what, 27 when he died? Got out of the army in 59 and played backup for greats like BB King, Muddy Waters and so on. My wife has always loved Benson though. The greatest what if question, what would Hendrix have done had he lived? Man, he had so much more in him, legal issues and drugs did him in. These two guys put a different perspective on it, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt. Pepper Posted June 28, 2020 Share Posted June 28, 2020 (edited) What baffles me is Hendrix is always in the top spot of every guitar poll of who is the greatest, yet he obviously hasn't played a note in 50 years. Which means since his death, not one guitarist has made any advancment with the instrument since he died. Laughable. Edited June 28, 2020 by Sgt. Pepper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparquelito Posted June 28, 2020 Share Posted June 28, 2020 best /best/ adjective of the most excellent, effective, or desirable type or quality. "the best pitcher in the league" It's all subjective, and that much is clear, at least by this point in the thread. To assign any guitar player in history the tag, "the best" is to invite criticism and sharp rebuke from others who have a different opinion. The problem isn't just that it become a matter of personal taste or preference for each listener, it's that there are very few quantifiable metrics by which we can judge a given guitar player. In the example provided above, "the best pitcher in the league," we at least have some hard statistics to rack and stack, and it's actually possible to make that determination. A pitcher is scored and ranked based upon their Earned Run Average, Field Independent Pitching numbers, and walks plus hits per inning pitched. So, for a given baseball season, you truly can state emphatically that this guy or that guy is the "best pitcher in the league". What numbers or stats do we have when making our own determination for "the best guitar player of the '60's"?Here a some quantifiable metrics, and bear in mind that these point to 'popularity' more so than technical prowess and guitar playing skill:* Number of records sold* Number of #1 hits* Number of weeks at the top of the charts * Number of tickets sold at concerts and live shows where the player was the headliner* Number of times, from 1960 to 1969, that the guitar player was ranked #1 by a panel of their peers and by the music criticsThere really are no hard statistics to use then, therefore, in determining the best. It's all a matter of personal opinion and tastes.And even that much is confounded by other strata of popularity factors such as player attractiveness, stage presence, innovative playing qualities, manner of dress, reputation among band mates as being likable and easy to get along with, etc, etc. Is Jimi Hendrix consistently rated #1 because he truly was the best, or is it because he was a ground-breaking innovator at a pivotal point in history?More importantly perhaps, would he be consistently rated #1 over all these years if he had not died?Bear in mind that, had he lived, he may well have gone on to innovate and wow audiences, and to make many, many hit records. But he might have also followed the Peter Frampton model, and, after having enormous success at one time in his career, gone on to have a normal, humble career, and slowly fallen out of the limelight. And in that normal flow of events, his mystique would have surely faded, and Jimi would always be thought of as one of the great guitar players, but not necessarily the greatest. George Benson is a fabulous talent, an admirable human being, and surely one of the very best guitar players of any decade. On that I think we can all agree. Okay, I'm gonna shut up now. 😐 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparquelito Posted June 28, 2020 Share Posted June 28, 2020 (No disrespect to Peter Frampton by the way. I love the man, listen to his newer music all the time, and admire his humble, gracious manner of communicating, playing, and doing business.)🙂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nifnof70 Posted June 28, 2020 Share Posted June 28, 2020 Impressive! I never saw that footage before or realized he's been around that long doing his thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uncle fester Posted June 28, 2020 Share Posted June 28, 2020 I thought Prince was the best. Hadn't that been decided already? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fortyearspickn Posted June 28, 2020 Share Posted June 28, 2020 Rolling Stone did a fairly fair Top 100 Guitarists of All Time study, using dozens of highly recognized musicians. Only TWO females in the entire group. Bonie Rait was 89 and Joni Mitchell not much higher. Makes you wonder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brad1 Posted June 28, 2020 Share Posted June 28, 2020 22 minutes ago, uncle fester said: I thought Prince was the best. Hadn't that been decided already? In 1969 Prince would have been 11 years old. He probably didn't even play the guitar in the 60s. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brad1 Posted June 28, 2020 Share Posted June 28, 2020 46 minutes ago, ghost_of_fl said: Everyone knows Lil Wayne is the future of guitar. Just cuz he wasn't around in the 60s doesn't mean he would have been any less than the best at that time. 🤥 And he's considered a musician! Really? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merciful-evans Posted June 28, 2020 Share Posted June 28, 2020 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retired Posted June 28, 2020 Share Posted June 28, 2020 8 hours ago, Sgt. Pepper said: What baffles me is Hendrix is always in the top spot of every guitar poll of who is the greatest, yet he obviously hasn't played a note in 50 years. Which means since his death, not one guitarist has made any advancment with the instrument since he died. Laughable. Absolutely, Just watching him play was amazing. the things he could do with a guitar I've seen no other do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mihcmac Posted June 28, 2020 Share Posted June 28, 2020 1 hour ago, Retired said: Absolutely, Just watching him play was amazing. the things he could do with a guitar I've seen no other do. One thing to consider is the time period when he came out and the speaker splitting sound he got with his Strat going into a Marshall. Eric in Cream at this time couldn't get clarity using an SG going into a Marshall, he and his engineers complained that the sound was getting muddy. Jimi also gravitated to playing a Strat upside down which puts the controls and tremolo right under his hand making them easier to reach for creating special effects and control. Then quite literally living with his guitar around his neck, it was his best friend I think. Constantly listening to the sounds of the world and learning to re-create them with his guitar. Not to mention many years of playing popular music. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brad1 Posted June 28, 2020 Share Posted June 28, 2020 54 minutes ago, mihcmac said: Then quite literally living with his guitar around his neck, it was his best friend I think. Constantly listening to the sounds of the world and learning to re-create them with his guitar. Not to mention many years of playing popular music. There have been many people like this. Nothing unique there at all imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaxson50 Posted June 28, 2020 Author Share Posted June 28, 2020 4 hours ago, merciful-evans said: One of my favorite albums ever Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mihcmac Posted June 28, 2020 Share Posted June 28, 2020 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt. Pepper Posted June 28, 2020 Share Posted June 28, 2020 (edited) 4 hours ago, Retired said: Absolutely, Just watching him play was amazing. the things he could do with a guitar I've seen no other do. I can set mine on fire, but won't. Love Jimi. Axis is my fav. Edited June 28, 2020 by Sgt. Pepper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt. Pepper Posted June 28, 2020 Share Posted June 28, 2020 12 minutes ago, ghost_of_fl said: One trick I've seriously never seen duplicated - playing with your teeth. Others have tried and some had a little success. But Jimi was the best teeth player ever hands down. 4 out of 5 dentist approved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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