Hall Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 DB, There rests your calling I suppose. Hall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krock Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 I can assure you there are plenty of bright, curious kids out there. I spend every day with them. They help me to feel young. I owe them for that. Thanks for backing us teenagers up. A few of my mates are exceptionally clever and are getting university offers from cambridge and oxford. I think its jsut the perception of kids that have changed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tman5293 Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 I think it's because of things like texting and instant messaging that people (especially younger people) just don't care about correct spelling or proper grammar. I'm a perfect example of this. Normally I could care less if I spell something wrong or my grammar is bad. I just really don't give a damn as long as the reader understands what I'm trying to say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riverside Posted February 8, 2011 Author Share Posted February 8, 2011 I think it's because of things like texting and instant messaging that people (especially younger people) just don't care about correct spelling or proper grammar. I'm a perfect example of this. Normally I could care less if I spell something wrong or my grammar is bad. I just really don't give a damn as long as the reader understands what I'm trying to say. Thanks for that. But what does one feel when the reader feels disrespected because one doesn't care to make the effort? Maybe that's my question. Do you feel a responsibility to your reader? Is that a young v. old issue? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tman5293 Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 Thanks for that. But what does one feel when the reader feels disrespected because one doesn't care to make the effort? Maybe that's my question. Do you feel a responsibility to your reader? Is that a young v. old issue? I guess I don't really think about the way the reader feels. Probably because I don't care about that either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WahKeen Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 I didn't bother to read the whole thread, but to suggest that back then there weren't any or as many, or it was rare seeing bad spellers and what not, is a total fallacy. today we see this more because of the technology available. I see a lot of kids who are excellent spellers, writers, thinkers, math whizzes, etc. And I see the struggling learners. someone or something is always blamed 4 "what's going on". now I'm not a young 1, and you see that I didn't capitalize starting my sentences. that's because I am voice writing this post on my android, and I quite frankly don't care to go back and correct it. I have masters level education and I am a teacher. Plus I dont need to prove myself on an internet forum. so, sorry if this has been rehashed. 2 cents. edit: I think an issue is when someone is being consistently bashed for spelling or any reason, they're going to get defensive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DB Cooper Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 I think it's because of things like texting and instant messaging that people (especially younger people) just don't care about correct spelling or proper grammar. I'm a perfect example of this. Normally I could care less if I spell something wrong or my grammar is bad. I just really don't give a damn as long as the reader understands what I'm trying to say. We've had this discussion many times in my classroom. Kids are actually quite insightful about the whole thing. They generally agree that it should be important to use language correctly and accurately, but they tend not to - and they acknowledge that. The interesting thing is that there has probably never been a time in human history where it has been more easy, quick, or convenient to use correct spelling, grammar, etc. - we have all the tools (keyboards, spellcheck, grammar check, etc.) - and yet our we continue to slip and slide away from that very thing. Think of this: when one had to pull out a feather quill, a bottle of ink, and a valuable sheet of paper, it would have been much more convenient and economical to write TTYL than Respectfully Yours... But I suppose it doesn't really matter anymore. ~DB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shnate McDuanus Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 I don't want to name names, but there are some adults on here who are very poor spellers. I've seen grammatical foibles from adults here, too. Heck, there's one poster around here who gets tons of respect for his every post, and at times he seems barely capable of forming a complete sentence. Again, I won't name names, but I think it's ignorant and discriminatory to criticize the younger posters for linguistic failures without looking at the similar linguistic failures of some of the older posters. In fact, from what I've seen, Nathan is one of the most grammatically and orthographically conscious individuals on the Forum, and he's only about the same age as I am. That's the only name I'll name here, and only in praise of his communicative skills. Oh, and on the topic of writing throughout history: the English spelling system wasn't really stable in any way until maybe the end of the seventeenth century with the advent of the first English dictionaries. It wasn't really until the end of the nineteenth century when standardized spelling conventions really became widely accepted. But I guess that's not really the point of this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silenced Fred Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 I don't want to name names, but there are some adults on here who are very poor spellers. I've seen grammatical foibles from adults here, too. Heck, there's one poster around here who gets tons of respect for his every post, and at times he seems barely capable of forming a complete sentence. Again, I won't name names, but I think it's ignorant and discriminatory to criticize the younger posters for linguistic failures without looking at the similar linguistic failures of some of the older posters. In fact, from what I've seen, Nathan is one of the most grammatically and orthographically conscious individuals on the Forum, and he's only about the same age as I am. That's the only name I'll name here, and only in praise of his communicative skills. And its weird because I know what those big words you posted mean I try to make it so very little can be wrongly inferred from any of my posts, but it still happens Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WahKeen Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 and why get bent out of shape if someone can't spell? just get over it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Natural Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 None of us are perfect spellers and grammarians. But, I think we should at least try to be better communicators. I think that if one is going to sit at a keyboard and create some message that is to be delivered to some target audience, one would want that message to be understood as intended. If we get to the point to where none of us care about proper grammar, spelling, capitalization, and punctuation, our posts will become little more than a string of unintelligible grunts. DB Cooper, it does "really matter". Communication matters. The_Whack_King, it's not about "proving" yourself "on an internet forum." Dem00n, you would "overview" your grammar and spelling in an school essay on the Emancipation Proclamation, "but this is a forum"? Why do you think you are going to school in the first place? School is "practice for real life". If you don't care to translate what you learn in school into the outside world, your (and your teachers') time will have been wasted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shnate McDuanus Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 I say unto thee: ugh ugh grunt grunt grunt blrrgh ugh grunt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarryUK Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 The fault lies with the teachers. I believe there's a 'de-education' of our children. The powers that be want an underclass to fuel the cheap labour. Grammar is important. It's like saying 'forget buying a Gibson, I'll have a £20 guitar'. The better the tool, the better the craftsman So. If you can spell, speak and converse with all classes you'll move forward. But, if you apply for a job in an office with things like 'alot, asif and aswell' you'll most likely not get an interview. Then you'll end up in Asda whilst the better educated will get the decent job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saturn Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 I don't want to name names, but there are some adults on here who are very poor spellers. I've seen grammatical foibles from adults here, too. Heck, there's one poster around here who gets tons of respect for his every post, and at times he seems barely capable of forming a complete sentence. Again, I won't name names, but I think it's ignorant and discriminatory to criticize the younger posters for linguistic failures without looking at the similar linguistic failures of some of the older posters. In fact, from what I've seen, Nathan is one of the most grammatically and orthographically conscious individuals on the Forum, and he's only about the same age as I am. That's the only name I'll name here, and only in praise of his communicative skills. Oh, and on the topic of writing throughout history: the English spelling system wasn't really stable in any way until maybe the end of the seventeenth century with the advent of the first English dictionaries. It wasn't really until the end of the nineteenth century when standardized spelling conventions really became widely accepted. But I guess that's not really the point of this thread. And its weird because I know what those big words you posted mean Heck, I'm 42 and have no idea what "orthographically" means. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WahKeen Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 The_Whack_King, it's not about "proving" yourself "on an internet forum." I'm speaking for myself. I don't want to go back and correct MY lack of capitalizations that my android fails to use when I speak into it for posting. I already correct enough when I say "panacea" and it writes "gonorrhea ". So, for me, I leave it as close to "as is", and don't worry much about proving that I could do better (since I don't feel like paying for a separate internet on my computer) otherwise I spend way too much time on a post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dem00n Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 Why are these threads around? Threads like these make people quit or stay away from the forum more than bring them in. I rather judge a person by the things they do not the way they type. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocky4 Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 and why get bent out of shape if someone can't spell? just get over it. Because it's wrong. Does anybody remember right from wrong? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vourot Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 Writing is the single most important invention of humanity. I have always been a reader. Reading a lot will enhance your spelling and grammer through osmosis. I wonder if I am in the minority these days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EvanPC Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 Blame MTV. There's a widening in the gap between the rich and the poor. The middle class is shrinking, while both the lower and upper socio-economic classes get larger. Yes, there is a percentage of children who are more advanced than we were at their age; and who are able to take advantage of the improvements in our technologies and informational systems. Conversely, I think there's a larger percentage which exists that are not able to take advantage of such things. A larger percentage who are growing up with different values and means for making a living. I think our society is capable of producing children who are more intelligent today than they were 50 years ago, however, I think we're producing less of them. The western world is getting dumber, and I think it's evident in the media content it produces, as well as the priorities its general public has. Oh, and not to mention the statistical fact that we here in the U.S. are getting our asses kicked in just about every major educational subject by the rest of the "civilized" world. These are just my opinions. Opinions of which I'm barely able to back up (though I'm pretty sure of the shrinking middle class and poor educational system scores compared to certain European/Asian nations). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff-7 Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 Semi-related to the thread, I saw a Valentine's balloon today which read "I luv u" with some text character resembling a smiley face I haven't received before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy R Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 I definitely agree. Being well spoken and having the ability to express yourself in written word is an extremely valuable skill and can make or break you in some instances. I admit that I get lazy when I'm trying to slam something out on here and also go back and edit when I notice something I have bumbled. I got C's D's and F's all through school and quit when I was 16. I always hated school and especially English. I did receive my GED when I was 18 and went to college for a couple of years and managed an A in my 131 English class. I have been fortunate enough to have a fairly good vocabulary and it has helped me quite a bit in my career. Now I have to communicate with global teams and have learned how important communications skills really are. It is actually part of the reason I enjoy the forum as it helps me communicate with a diverse group of people. I'm still terrible at spelling and my punctuation is poor at best.. Thank goodness for spell check and my girlfriend who is usually sitting right next to me because she has a degree in teaching. We have to also keep in mind that not everyone on here is a native English speaking person. Just some thoughts. Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WahKeen Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 Because it's wrong. Does anybody remember right from wrong? "The sky is falling". that's when I'll get bent out of shape. But I'm not going to have a cow when a small % of posters in a forum don't spell rite ( intentional ). But, that's just me. I've got more important things to do like clip my toenails... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WahKeen Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 I don't think anybody is advocating illiteracy here. of course reading and writing are important for communication and success. I think this thread went from 1 or 2 persons that don't spell correctly, to " what's wrong with kids these days" generalizations, when there are just as many brilliant kids out there who most likely don't hang around here. 1.5 cents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DAS44 Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 How's about this. I appreciate proper spelling and grammar (though I know I flop at times in this regard, I try not to), but I won't bug you if you don't follow "proper" grammar. Its appreciated, but I'm not going to get in a twist over it. I'm going to refrain from correcting grammar from here on out, its your choice, I'd like it, but so long as you get the point across I'll survive. Goodnight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
surfpup Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 Wow, this thread took off... A few thoughts... The world has certainly changed. That's the way it always has been and the way it always will be. You cannot expect the 1950s to exist in the same time that the Internet exists. It is not going to happen. The Beaver has left the building! On a related note, do not expect young people to respect you solely because you are older than them. There is a fair amount of research related to the decline of positional authority in our society. But here's the short version... remember Rock & Roll's early days? Remember the 60's? Remember punk rock? Well it all said **** AUTHORITY! Guess what? Kids listened... Which leads me to point 3, there is plenty of respect to be had from younger folks - it just needs to be earned. Would you have kids respect someone automatically and deferentially, regardless of their wisdom or expertise? Or would you prefer they question authority and demand some semblance of competence before deferring to them? I'd certainly choose the latter. As for this forum and forums like it, it seems to me that the younger folks here have a different ethic. To them it's more like a chat room. While I might (okay I do) edit my posts carefully to ensure clear communication via correct usage, to them it's like having a conversation in the hallway - casual and unedited. Many of them have also stopped reading this post by now because something sparkly has caught their attention. It is what it is. Can't say I blame them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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