jaxson50 Posted September 17, 2013 Share Posted September 17, 2013 Been thinking about getting a short scale steel string guitar but thought I should run my idea past you folks first.Want do you love and what do you hate about them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milod Posted September 17, 2013 Share Posted September 17, 2013 Jax... I've had both; most of my current ones are now long scale. Works fine for either capo work or basic old time/bluegrass pickin'. For fingerpicking I tend to prefer short scale for the easier playing fancy stuff on the lower frets. I've heard folks suggest that this or that scale makes a big difference in how a given guitar body sounds, and given different sorts of strings, etc., I can believe that for some folks it may be an important factor. Frankly I don't feel there's enough difference for what I do to make me worry about it. That's even when I've done backup for fiddlers, grass, folkie strumming, etc., etc. Then again, my schtick tends more toward playability than finer points of "tone." Also I do more fingerpicking than flatpicking nowadays. But here's the deal as I see it: A lot depends on the individual's physical geometry too. I have a 25 1/2 inch scale Epi PR5e that's almost identical in ways to the size and shape of an ES175 that's short scale. Here's the odd thing: I find that playing the PR5e almost as easy up and down the neck as the shorter scale 175. I find a short scale dread harder to play and a "longer reach" than the longer scale on a smaller box. It's to the point that it makes fancier fingerpicking much more difficult. On electrics, it's about the same "shape" deal. I find a 335's 24 3/4 neck seems much longer than the 175 at the same scale. In fact, so much so that I didn't believe the nut was the same width as others that seem narrower until I measured it. Why? My left arm felt as if it were reaching longer and the fingers had more of an angle to the strings instead of pretty much the 90 degrees on a more "classical guitar sized box." So... whatever fits, I'd say. What does it sound and feel like to you? What are your priorities for what you do with it? Frankly I have two web-purchased nice, but relatively inexpensive, 25 1/2 scale cutaway AE dreads in hard cases I'd just about as soon sell/trade or give to a cupla nephews for Christmas... m Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tman Posted September 17, 2013 Share Posted September 17, 2013 I prefer short scale, 24.75 compared to the longer 25.5. Easier to play for me. When my band gets together once a year we play covers and I play "Message in a Bottle" on the strat and my hands sometimes cramp. Played on a Les Paul, no problem, but the sound isn't authentic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted September 17, 2013 Share Posted September 17, 2013 To me, the feel of a guitar seems to depend on sizes, weight and centre of gravity as well as on scale length. So may a shorter scaled guitar feel "longer" for the player like e. g. Gibson SGs (except those from the 1970s with lower neck joint) than the longer scaled Fender Stratocasters. Indeed my SG basses' nuts have the same reach like that of my SG guitars. So I believe it is best to check it out. At least this is the only thing left for me, and especially when I started playing it was very critical. I do have wide fingers AND a short reach, I basically would need a short scale on lower and a long scale on higher frets, wide string spacing and very slim fret wire. The latest two points I could overcome by having custom guitars built or by exclusively playing classical what I never did and assumably never will do. Honestly, I make most of my efforts when playing guitar or bass to overcome these personal weaknesses, and I think this won't change forever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rct Posted September 17, 2013 Share Posted September 17, 2013 I prefer short scale, 24.75 compared to the longer 25.5. Easier to play for me. When my band gets together once a year we play covers and I play "Message in a Bottle" on the strat and my hands sometimes cramp. Played on a Les Paul, no problem, but the sound isn't authentic. My hands cramp no matter what guitar I use for that song. People just don't know the sacrifices we make for our art. rct Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted September 17, 2013 Share Posted September 17, 2013 I prefer short scale, 24.75 compared to the longer 25.5. Easier to play for me. When my band gets together once a year we play covers and I play "Message in a Bottle" on the strat and my hands sometimes cramp. Played on a Les Paul, no problem, but the sound isn't authentic. It may read like a heresy, but I experienced that playing the thick late 1950s' neck Les Paul Traditional is more comfortable than the widely spreaded Slim Taper necks. I have lots of the latter and basically started playing with them, so I guess will go on managing to deal with it. The Fender necks feel a bit thicker than Gibson's Slim Tapered what makes chord fretting easier for me. It cannot be the fretboard radius since the compound radius American Deluxe Telecaster of mine plays fantastic. The latter and my LP Traditional even allow for easier chord fretting than my SG Supra with asymmetrical 1960s neck profile which basically feels nicer than Slim Tapering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted September 17, 2013 Share Posted September 17, 2013 My hands cramp no matter what guitar I use for that song. People just don't know the sacrifices we make for our art. rct +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tman Posted September 17, 2013 Share Posted September 17, 2013 My hands cramp no matter what guitar I use for that song. People just don't know the sacrifices we make for our art. rct lol! To be honest I should have said my hand cramps everytime I play that song. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocky4 Posted September 17, 2013 Share Posted September 17, 2013 With small hands, I like the short scale. Didn't Jeff Beck once say that Les Pauls were for sissies? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twang Gang Posted September 17, 2013 Share Posted September 17, 2013 Depends on the size of your hands or more specifically length of fingers. The shorter scale is easier to make long reaches, but the difference isn't so great that you can't adapt to either. Tonewise I don't think it makes a bit of difference. Each guitar is designed with a specific scale length and will perform as it was designed. With acoustics the shorter scales are usually somewhat smaller guitars so less volume but so many come equiped with pickups now that you just plug it in and can be heard anywhere. The shape of the neck (radius) has a lot to do with the comfort of playing a guitar as well. I have two Gibsons that are 24.75 and a Taylor and a Tele that are 25.5, but the Taylor neck is slim and comfortable so I don't notice a difficulty playing it compared to the Gibsons. When you divide the extra 3/4 of an inch by the 20 or 22 frets it isn't a huge differene to make up - especially higher up on the neck. But to answer your question directly I find nothing to dislike about a shorter scale neck. In all the factors in evaluating a new guitar purchase the scale is pretty far down the list for me. If I like the tone and the feel either scale will do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted September 17, 2013 Share Posted September 17, 2013 In my opinion, for its sound the basic design of the entire guitar is of more importance than scale length. Comparing the typical 24.75" Gibson scale to the classical full scale of 25.5" mostly used by Fender, the string tension differs about only 3% (linear proportionality). This determines the energy a string can bring into a resonant body or a transducer. Gauges are much more important in this respect. When changing from a .010" to a .011" string set, the difference is about 21%, and between .009" and .010" sets it is about 23.5% (quadratic proportionality, based on cross-section area, not on its diameter). There is an evident comparison possible in my arsenal. Among my piezo equipped guitars are two modded Fender Stratocasters and a Gibson Alex Lifeson Les Paul Axcess that use the same type Graph Tech Ghost LB63 piezo system including electronics, setup and strings. With respect to attack, both the Strats put out an insignificant higher piezo level than the Les Paul does, and it might be about 3% (0.2...0.3dB). For these piezos I use the same acoustic amp settings what of course wouldn't match for the magnetics where the Gibson 496R and 498T are somewhat hotter than the Fender SCNs (6...8dB in all positions), and by far hotter than the Fender Vintage Noiseless (8...14dB from neck to bridge). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quapman Posted September 17, 2013 Share Posted September 17, 2013 I can honestly say I have never considered one over the other. Nor do I really know what it means. Maybe I will go home tonight and compare my guitars. Maybe I have a preference and I don't even know it.. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quapman Posted September 18, 2013 Share Posted September 18, 2013 Well I have checked all mine and they are all over the map so I guess I have no preference. Everything from 24.75 to 25.5 My Squire Strat and Hamer Chaparral are both 25.5 My LPCC an Hamer double cut are both 24.75 My acoustics range from 24.75 on my Gib to 25.5 on my Tak. Can you really tell the difference in 3/4 of an inch? Maybe I'm not a good enough player to feel the difference but I just don't get it. I can see if you are just starting out or a kid would care and desire a shorter scale but after a couple decades of playing I don't really care. I don't care too much about nut width either. After about 20 minutes or so playing on any guitar I can get comfortable. As long as it's not a piece of crap. I don't see all the fuss about one or the other IMHO. And I don't have huge hands. So sorry Jax,, I have no opinion... lol I'm sure you will do just fine with either one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fretplay Posted September 18, 2013 Share Posted September 18, 2013 Most of we Gibson players are on short scale 24.75. To me this is most comfortable on acoustic but I do have a Fender Tele that is standard 25.5 which I us for solos but I prefer a short scale for finger picking. I would guess a large hand would be more comfortable standard but then people love the Gibson Byrdland and thats 23 dead, now that's too short for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Versatile Posted September 18, 2013 Share Posted September 18, 2013 I have 22.5", 24.75" and 25.5" electrics...as already mentioned, overall dimensions and C of G influence playability also... Never bothered to measure acoustics' scale length as body size seems more pertinent...particularly depth... V Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdgm Posted September 18, 2013 Share Posted September 18, 2013 I was a Fender guy Whoops!! - I mean long-scale guy for years, all my guitar-playing life; Strat, Tele (still a wonderful design) and some custom-made archtops - the maker insisted that long-scale guitars were/are generally 'more in tune' - until just over 2 years ago I finally sprang for a beautiful Gibson Les Paul. So now I've gone completely the other way and it was only last weekend that I picked up the Strat for a good long blast and realised yet again what a great guitar it is. Long-scale vs. short/medium-scale? We've had a thread about this before I think. Longer scale guitars might just be a 'more in tune', may have a slightly different sound (perhaps chord notes don't mush up so much) but IMO you do have to work 'em a bit harder. A Strat and a Tele, that's sort of bedrock....because if you can do it on a Strat you can do it on any guitar, and if you can't do it on a Tele you probably won't do it on anything else either. My LP is much easier to play in comparison. I use the same string sets and gauges on all. And a 330 is even shorter! Regards! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milod Posted September 18, 2013 Share Posted September 18, 2013 My experience indicates Versatile may be more in tune with reality on acoustics than he might imagine - and I'd add a "ditto" for various archtops and even "full size" 335-type semis and equivalent. I think the overall body size of the guitar is awfully important on comfort levels for a given player who has a given basic "style" of holding the guitar and approaching the neck. I'd also agree about string choices, etc., as being more important to tone than the scale but... Just take a look at the Gibson acoustic forum and you'll have many of the "mostly acoustic" pickers proclaiming bridge peg changes make major changes in tone. I'm still convinced that physical comfort for a given picker, and consideration of how the instrument will be used, are major factors in one's guitar choice. I'm perfectly happy with a bit of a less comfortable dread when I'm doing basic flatpicking rhythm stuff for old time/grass/folkie. But for most of my solo work, I'm mostly using a guitar that's roughly an ES175/classical size and shape, fingerpicking and run through amplification whether AE or mag pup electric. The scale seems less important with that size and proportions. m Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manse Posted September 18, 2013 Share Posted September 18, 2013 I prefer short scale, 24.75 compared to the longer 25.5. Easier to play for me. When my band gets together once a year we play covers and I play "Message in a Bottle" on the strat and my hands sometimes cramp. Played on a Les Paul, no problem, but the sound isn't authentic. Yeah - I struggled to learn "Message in a Bottle' on my telecaster - switched to a Jaguar and *bingo* Those are tiring stretches.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aster1 Posted September 18, 2013 Share Posted September 18, 2013 My hands cramp no matter what guitar I use for that song. People just don't know the sacrifices we make for our art. rct Not to mention all the sour notes that I hit along the way, and it's even-steven between long vs short scale for me!! Aster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaxson50 Posted September 26, 2013 Author Share Posted September 26, 2013 1379537645[/url]' post='1427066']Not to mention all the sour notes that I hit along the way, and it's even-steven between long vs short scale for me!! Aster When you hit sour notes, just smile and bend the note..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quapman Posted October 24, 2013 Share Posted October 24, 2013 I prefer short scale, 24.75 compared to the longer 25.5. Easier to play for me. When my band gets together once a year we play covers and I play "Message in a Bottle" on the strat and my hands sometimes cramp. Played on a Les Paul, no problem, but the sound isn't authentic. My hands cramp no matter what guitar I use for that song. People just don't know the sacrifices we make for our art. rct lol! To be honest I should have said my hand cramps everytime I play that song. OK,, I get it. Having never played that tune and recalling this thread I thought I would give it a go... Damn... Neither scale is easy on that one. I have smallish hands so that stretch is about it for me. I can't stretch any more than that. That ones gonna take some practice. I will consider it fretboard yoga.. Maybe I need a little neck like that that old 12 string Dave is restoring... You bastards.... ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Izzy Posted October 24, 2013 Share Posted October 24, 2013 I have smallish hands so that stretch is about it for me. I can't stretch any more than that. That ones gonna take some practice. I will consider it fretboard yoga.. Maybe I need a little neck like that that old 12 string Dave is restoring... You bastards.... ;) DUO SONIC put rails on that B and bond with Heather Nova fans Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buxom Posted October 24, 2013 Share Posted October 24, 2013 Short scale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie brown Posted October 24, 2013 Share Posted October 24, 2013 No real preference...Except for Bass. I much prefer short scale basses, as I'm not a "bass player," per se, so it's much easier, for me, to go from guitar, to a short scale bass, than a "normal" scale bass. CB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Searcy Posted October 24, 2013 Share Posted October 24, 2013 DUO SONIC put rails on that B and bond with Heather Nova fans Heather Nova... There's a name I haven't heard in many years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.