What lessons have we learned in the past three years?

[jdgm]

..."Trumpkin".....

Hadn't heard that one.

Edited March 22, 2022 by jdgm

[Californiaman]

Regarding the use of foul language by black entertainers.

Red Fox: Dirtiest mouth in comedy during the '60s and early 70s.

Richard Pryor: Filthiest mouth in comedy during the mid 70s and 80s.

Eddie Murray: Nastiest comedian during the late 80s and 90s.

They all had several things in common.

They were black comedians with a vulgar act.  And we sat back and laughed our aszs off.

[Tman]

I've learned in the past 3 days that most folks here with a widely disparate set of beliefs, opinions, and political leanings can actually express them and agree to disagree with only a few **** you's or **** offs. We must be getting older.

[jaxson50]

1 hour ago, Californiaman said:

Regarding the use of foul language by black entertainers.

Red Fox: Dirtiest mouth in comedy during the '60s and early 70s.

Richard Pryor: Filthiest mouth in comedy during the mid 70s and 80s.

Eddie Murray: Nastiest comedian during the late 80s and 90s.

They all had several things in common.

They were black comedians with a vulgar act.  And we sat back and laughed our aszs off.

Thank you for providing evidence. Point is, if racist imagery is going to be weeded out of our vocabulary everyone will have to participate.  

I'm glad you agree.

[jaxson50]

3 hours ago, ghost_of_fl said:

Woke = a buzzword used mainly by conservatives to silence (liberal) opinions they don't agree with. 

Misinformation = a buzzword used mainly by liberals to silence (conservative) opinions they don't agree with.

Mansplaining = a buzzword used mainly by women to silence (male) opinions they don't agree with.

"Karen" = a buzzword used mainly to describe white females and used to shame/silence them as a way of disarming their perceived "privilege" and social power. 

"hysterical/panic/afraid/fear" = buzzwords used by anyone to gaslight/silence opinions they don't agree with. 

I'm with David Byrne .... "Same as it ever was, same as it ever was". 

Woke originated Inn the 1940s,  it was used by civil rights activists to identify people who were aware of racism. 

In its current reincarnation it was resurrected by left-wing activists after Erykah Badu’s song “Master Teacher” was released in 2008. 

Quote

Even if yo baby ain't got no money
To support ya baby, you
(I stay woke)
Even when the preacher tell you some lies
And cheatin on ya mama, you stay woke
(I stay woke)
Even though you go through struggle and strife
To keep a healthy life, I stay woke
(I stay woke)
Everybody knows a black or a white there's creatures in every shape and size
Everybody
(I stay woke)

The fact that conservatives are critical of it doesn't mean they created it. It has become a tool of anti capitalist.

Last  I checked, capitalist have the right to defend their opinions 

[fortyearspickn]

You left off a big one:     "Insurrection",     but you're 100% right.  These buzzwords are used to silence others.   Sort of like bullying on steroids.    We here have much more in common with each other, as has been pointed out.  And yet, as has also been pointed out, we cannot change each others minds.  Because, I believe,  our minds (values, opinions) have been developing for decades.  Mostly from what we see, hear, read in the media.   And more recently - Social Media.    We're screwed.   Peace, out. 

[gdecantoo]

Within the last three years I have reached the age of junior senior citizen and have learned that it is entirely possible to get stuck in an under inflated air mattress!

[Whitefang]

17 hours ago, Californiaman said:

 

Eddie Murray: Nastiest comedian during the late 80s and 90s.

They all had several things in common.

They were black comedians with a vulgar act.  And we sat back and laughed our aszs off.

Do you mean the former DH and first baseman for the Baltimore Orioles? ('77-'88)  Who later played for the LA Dodgers, Mets and Cleveland?

I had NO idea he sidelined as a stand-up!   Unless.....

You meant Eddie MURPHY...?   

16 hours ago, jaxson50 said:

Woke originated Inn the 1940s,  it was used by civil rights activists to identify people who were aware of racism. 

In its current reincarnation it was resurrected by left-wing activists after Erykah Badu’s song “Master Teacher” was released in 2008. 

The fact that conservatives are critical of it doesn't mean they created it. It has become a tool of anti capitalist.

Last  I checked, capitalist have the right to defend their opinions 

Far as I know,  people who were aware of racism weren't necessarily "anti-capitalist". 

And your statement is confusing as it appears you're trying to claim it's conservatives that are critical of the term "woke" when indeed, these days THEY are the ones most likely to babble it.  Unless you meant to say conservatives are critical of anti-racism.  Which really isn't always necessarily so.    Look....

Many people vote for the person or party they do for a variety of reasons.  some good, and some puzzling.  For example...

I had two brothers in law, who were also brothers and thought alike.  They were(past tense due to them both being deceased) both pro gun, pro death penalty, anti-gay, anti-abortion, racially bigoted sexist neanderthals.  Everything most people would expect to be republican voters.  Yet when every fourth year election rolled around they voted for the DEMOCRAT!  Why?

Because they(like too many) being long time autoworkers and U.A.W. members labored under the delusion that democrats were always in favor of the working man, and republicans all favored the wealthy fat cats.  That may be true to an extent, but an unreliable criteria for a voting choice. 

Whitefang

[jaxson50]

37 minutes ago, Whitefang said:

Do you mean the former DH and first baseman for the Baltimore Orioles? ('77-'88)  Who later played for the LA Dodgers, Mets and Cleveland?

I had NO idea he sidelined as a stand-up!   Unless.....

You meant Eddie MURPHY...?   

Far as I know,  people who were aware of racism weren't necessarily "anti-capitalist". 

And your statement is confusing as it appears you're trying to claim it's conservatives that are critical of the term "woke" when indeed, these days THEY are the ones most likely to babble it.  Unless you meant to say conservatives are critical of anti-racism.  Which really isn't always necessarily so.    Look....

Many people vote for the person or party they do for a variety of reasons.  some good, and some puzzling.  For example...

I had two brothers in law, who were also brothers and thought alike.  They were(past tense due to them both being deceased) both pro gun, pro death penalty, anti-gay, anti-abortion, racially bigoted sexist neanderthals.  Everything most people would expect to be republican voters.  Yet when every fourth year election rolled around they voted for the DEMOCRAT!  Why?

Because they(like too many) being long time autoworkers and U.A.W. members labored under the delusion that democrats were always in favor of the working man, and republicans all favored the wealthy fat cats.  That may be true to an extent, but an unreliable criteria for a voting choice. 

Whitefang

Whitefang, 

I have yet to see or hear any " conservatives " apply or invoke " Woke " doctrine. I have witnessed conservatives react to criticism from the " Woke " movement.  If you can provide such evidence that would be enlightening. 

So far I have provided references to any claim I have made regarding the "woke " movement.  Woke ideology is the product of the progressive movement.  It is specifically used to stop discussions pertaining to specific topics.

The nation I grew up in celebrates free speech and the exchange of ideas. Woke university staff have denied conservative speakers from having access to campuses,.. What are they afraid of? 

As to gay rights, it is established law that gays be protected from discrimination,  no conservative that I know of is against equality for gays, or people of color. What they are opposed to is the establishment of special rights that supersede those rights granted everyone.  

Cases in point,  the NYC library that allows and promote Trans Book Reading programs, where drag queens dressed up in their costumes read questionable books to minors without parental consent.  

Or the teaching of gender fluidity to children to young to understand the subject.  

Democracy is two wolves and one lamb deciding what's for dinner.  Without challenges to new concepts and untested theories we would still have Japanese Americans in detainment camps, an action carried out by the order of the most liberal president in our history,  FDR.   

In 2019, 2020 and 2021, we watched as radical groups destroyed private and public property with no consequence because liberal mayors, govorners and district attorney's ordered police to stand down. When the president offered help he was pilloried by the press and his political opponents. As a result hundreds of millions of dollars in damage was done to court houses, police stations, officers were attacked. Very few were held accountable because the left wanted chaos in hopes of undermining a sitting president.  I know you will blame conservatives for these events. Like blaming banks for armed robbery because the banks have money, or blaming police for crime. 

I do not consider myself a conservative,  or a liberal,  but a pragmatist,  I consider Obama to be more pragmatic than liberal. Did he make mistakes? Certainly,  we all do, but he reined in the radical progressives in his party, and they criticised him for it. 

Bottom line,  when extremist from any political spectrum take actions,  the political opposition aka their counterparts will also take action.  Every protest draws counter protesters. Assigning responsibility for the results of those actions taken by extremists to mainstream liberal or conservative citizens is not only unfair it's partisan and serves no possible benefit to the nation.

[DanvillRob]

1 hour ago, jaxson50 said:

Whitefang, 

I have yet to see or hear any " conservatives " apply or invoke " Woke " doctrine. I have witnessed conservatives react to criticism from the " Woke " movement.  If you can provide such evidence that would be enlightening. 

So far I have provided references to any claim I have made regarding the "woke " movement.  Woke ideology is the product of the progressive movement.  It is specifically used to stop discussions pertaining to specific topics.

The nation I grew up in celebrates free speech and the exchange of ideas. Woke university staff have denied conservative speakers from having access to campuses,.. What are they afraid of? 

As to gay rights, it is established law that gays be protected from discrimination,  no conservative that I know of is against equality for gays, or people of color. What they are opposed to is the establishment of special rights that supersede those rights granted everyone.  

Cases in point,  the NYC library that allows and promote Trans Book Reading programs, where drag queens dressed up in their costumes read questionable books to minors without parental consent.  

Or the teaching of gender fluidity to children to young to understand the subject.  

Democracy is two wolves and one lamb deciding what's for dinner.  Without challenges to new concepts and untested theories we would still have Japanese Americans in detainment camps, an action carried out by the order of the most liberal president in our history,  FDR.   

In 2019, 2020 and 2021, we watched as radical groups destroyed private and public property with no consequence because liberal mayors, govorners and district attorney's ordered police to stand down. When the president offered help he was pilloried by the press and his political opponents. As a result hundreds of millions of dollars in damage was done to court houses, police stations, officers were attacked. Very few were held accountable because the left wanted chaos in hopes of undermining a sitting president.  I know you will blame conservatives for these events. Like blaming banks for armed robbery because the banks have money, or blaming police for crime. 

I do not consider myself a conservative,  or a liberal,  but a pragmatist,  I consider Obama to be more pragmatic than liberal. Did he make mistakes? Certainly,  we all do, but he reined in the radical progressives in his party, and they criticised him for it. 

Bottom line,  when extremist from any political spectrum take actions,  the political opposition aka their counterparts will also take action.  Every protest draws counter protesters. Assigning responsibility for the results of those actions taken by extremists to mainstream liberal or conservative citizens is not only unfair it's partisan and serves no possible benefit to the nation.

All good and valid points.   
I’ve noticed that people give people with their political views much, MUCH leeway, while giving people who have different political viewpoints zero leeway.

example: Ukraine…..President Trump impeached for telling Zelinski to investigate Biden’s son’s involvement with a sketchy energy company…the left FURIOUS with his not being forced to leave office.   Biden & son have AMPLE evidence of corruption in Ukraine (Hunter’s laptop), the left silent or spouts “Russian Misinformation”.    

[Tman]

33 minutes ago, DanvillRob said:

All good and valid points.   
I’ve noticed that people give people with their political views much, MUCH leeway, while giving people who have different political viewpoints zero leeway.

example: Ukraine…..President Trump impeached for telling Zelinski to investigate Biden’s son’s involvement with a sketchy energy company…the left FURIOUS with his not being forced to leave office.   Biden & son have AMPLE evidence of corruption in Ukraine (Hunter’s laptop), the left silent or spouts “Russian Misinformation”.    

Or collusion

[tx-ogre]

11 hours ago, fortyearspickn said:

You left off a big one:     "Insurrection",     but you're 100% right.  These buzzwords are used to silence others.   Sort of like bullying on steroids.    We here have much more in common with each other, as has been pointed out.  And yet, as has also been pointed out, we cannot change each others minds.  Because, I believe,  our minds (values, opinions) have been developing for decades.  Mostly from what we see, hear, read in the media.   And more recently - Social Media.    We're screwed.   Peace, out. 

These buzzwords tend to be hurled out there when people say outrageous things and get called out, with requests for facts or evidence.  Rather than debate and explain their position logically and rationally,  because their position is based on emotions rather than facts, they resort to the inevitable trash-talking, referring to those who disagree with them as racists, homophobes xenophobes, etc.  One person’s “mostly peaceful demonstration” (with the 100 ft. fireball in the background) is another person’s insurrection and a threat to democracy.  Really?  We will never have a constructive dialogue about anything as long as this pathetic hypocrisy exists.

[jaxson50]

I my view, all rioting deserves our condemnation,  period. I don't care where it takes place or which extremist groups are carrying it out.  

Antifa, BLM, Proud Boys, and on and on, they all seek  civil unrest and anarchy.  

 

Edited March 24, 2022 by jaxson50

[Whitefang]

22 hours ago, jaxson50 said:

Whitefang, 

I have yet to see or hear any " conservatives " apply or invoke " Woke " doctrine. I have witnessed conservatives react to criticism from the " Woke " movement.  If you can provide such evidence that would be enlightening. 

So far I have provided references to any claim I have made regarding the "woke " movement.  Woke ideology is the product of the progressive movement.  It is specifically used to stop discussions pertaining to specific topics.

The nation I grew up in celebrates free speech and the exchange of ideas. Woke university staff have denied conservative speakers from having access to campuses,.. What are they afraid of? 

As to gay rights, it is established law that gays be protected from discrimination,  no conservative that I know of is against equality for gays, or people of color. What they are opposed to is the establishment of special rights that supersede those rights granted everyone.  

Cases in point,  the NYC library that allows and promote Trans Book Reading programs, where drag queens dressed up in their costumes read questionable books to minors without parental consent.  

Or the teaching of gender fluidity to children to young to understand the subject.  

Democracy is two wolves and one lamb deciding what's for dinner.  Without challenges to new concepts and untested theories we would still have Japanese Americans in detainment camps, an action carried out by the order of the most liberal president in our history,  FDR.   

In 2019, 2020 and 2021, we watched as radical groups destroyed private and public property with no consequence because liberal mayors, govorners and district attorney's ordered police to stand down. When the president offered help he was pilloried by the press and his political opponents. As a result hundreds of millions of dollars in damage was done to court houses, police stations, officers were attacked. Very few were held accountable because the left wanted chaos in hopes of undermining a sitting president.  I know you will blame conservatives for these events. Like blaming banks for armed robbery because the banks have money, or blaming police for crime. 

I do not consider myself a conservative,  or a liberal,  but a pragmatist,  I consider Obama to be more pragmatic than liberal. Did he make mistakes? Certainly,  we all do, but he reined in the radical progressives in his party, and they criticised him for it. 

Bottom line,  when extremist from any political spectrum take actions,  the political opposition aka their counterparts will also take action.  Every protest draws counter protesters. Assigning responsibility for the results of those actions taken by extremists to mainstream liberal or conservative citizens is not only unfair it's partisan and serves no possible benefit to the nation.

Ah, see?  That's what happens when you don't read carefully.

I never ONCE stated that ANY conservatives apply or "invoke" "woke" doctrine.  But that indeed, it mostly are conservatives who use the term to indicate and disparage any train of thought or action that counters their dogmatic beliefs. 

As for "gay rights" I do know of several people(and personal friends) who were either denied employment, housing,  or service in some stores and restaurants by being "openly" gay.  And the people who denied them those things were admitted conservatives.  And remember it was republican president George W. Bush who worked fervently to prevent the advent of same sex marriage.  

And it's only in online forums and other internet outlets that I ever hear or read about schools teaching "gender fluidity" and other such fallacy.  So far, I've never heard any such complaints about those things from family members and friends and neighbors who have school age children.   

And sure, I thought it not only unwarranted but also misguided for some to take pot shots at police, especially those in another city far removed from the city in which some nationwide outcry about police brutality took place.  But then who do we blame for letting the indiscriminate  murder of clearly innocent young black men by police go unaddressed?  And what's gained by blaming uninvolved people(of some ideological camp) that didn't do the harm when the carnage of the massive uprisings in protest occur? 

"Pragmatist"?  Sure.  That's a pretty neutral way to put it.  I mostly consider myself a "Centrist".  Amounts to basically the same thing.

Peace out.  And later....

Whitefang

[jaxson50]

2 hours ago, Whitefang said:

Ah, see?  That's what happens when you don't read carefully.

I never ONCE stated that ANY conservatives apply or "invoke" "woke" doctrine.  But that indeed, it mostly are conservatives who use the term to indicate and disparage any train of thought or action that counters their dogmatic beliefs. 

As for "gay rights" I do know of several people(and personal friends) who were either denied employment, housing,  or service in some stores and restaurants by being "openly" gay.  And the people who denied them those things were admitted conservatives.  And remember it was republican president George W. Bush who worked fervently to prevent the advent of same sex marriage.  

And it's only in online forums and other internet outlets that I ever hear or read about schools teaching "gender fluidity" and other such fallacy.  So far, I've never heard any such complaints about those things from family members and friends and neighbors who have school age children.   

And sure, I thought it not only unwarranted but also misguided for some to take pot shots at police, especially those in another city far removed from the city in which some nationwide outcry about police brutality took place.  But then who do we blame for letting the indiscriminate  murder of clearly innocent young black men by police go unaddressed?  And what's gained by blaming uninvolved people(of some ideological camp) that didn't do the harm when the carnage of the massive uprisings in protest occur? 

"Pragmatist"?  Sure.  That's a pretty neutral way to put it.  I mostly consider myself a "Centrist".  Amounts to basically the same thing.

Peace out.  And later....

Whitefang

Question,

Do you consider those who disagrees with all progressive ideas as obstructionist who have no constitutional grounds to resist or question progressive principles or ideas?

As this nation is based on constitutional law, where in the constitution does it indicate that liberal agendas can not be held up to review by duly elected representatives?

Hers is another president who did not support gay marriage 

 

Edited March 24, 2022 by jaxson50

[Sgt. Pepper]

I woke up this morning, but no one had to explain to me slavery, Putin, and Kanye West were bad. 

[merciful-evans]

16 hours ago, Sgt. Pepper said:

I woke up this morning, but no one had to explain to me slavery, Putin, and Kanye West were bad. 

Cool. Its like the 1st line of a BB King song.

2nd line is: 

I said I woke up this morning, but no one had to explain to me slavery, Putin, and Kanye West were bad.

[fortyearspickn]

On 3/23/2022 at 10:39 AM, Whitefang said:

Do you mean the former DH and first baseman for the Baltimore Orioles? ('77-'88)  Who later played for the LA Dodgers, Mets and Cleveland?

I had NO idea he sidelined as a stand-up!   Unless.....

You meant Eddie MURPHY...?

When someone goes the extra mile, as Californian did, to provide facts in a discussion, it does not enhance the discussion or elevate your own credibility when you attack his spelling.  In fact it does the opposite.     I'm guessing you saw 'Eddie Murray" and knew immediately who CAman meant - but went to Google to find some arcane person named 'Murray' you could throw back at him with some factoids going back nearly 45 years as if you could roll them off your tongue.  Since this is a serious discussion, suggesting you were only being funny doesn't work:   It was meant to detract from the point being made.   

I made a New Years Resolution that I would never ever use the Sad.Angry,Confuse emojis on this forum and have gotten further into the year than ever before with a NY Resolution: Have not used them this year and believe I can safely say I never will.     Often those who oppose the use of those negatory emojis  suggest that instead, you man-up and explain what you're unhappy about under your own sign on name.    So - that's what I'm doing here: providing Constructive Criticism!  😀

[fortyearspickn]

But then who do we blame for letting the indiscriminate  murder of clearly innocent young black men by police go unaddressed?  

Just curious - what is an example of this?  When I see news stories about a shooting involving police, I don't know what happened, just the end result.  I wasn't there and the news reporter wasn't either. 

 

WhiteFang,   You made the claim that murder is going unaddressed in the US.  You made it more specific by claiming it was racist. I suppose 'systemically racist' since you believe it is the Justice System.   

GhostFL  asked for examples.   I'd like more than just a dismissive   "Breona Taylor - say her name". 

I've read studies that have looked at ALL these shootings by police and concluded that less than a dozen each year were negligent. I think you can count on one finger the number that were actually  MURDER, based on the definition.  The rest were either Self Defense, or Accidental.  There is a difference, of course between accidental and negligent.   The media will take a case like Breona Taylor and spin it immediately without half the facts  As Ghost suggested - it takes time to decide if a shooting is even chargeable to get it to court.   

I assume you believe all our courts are 'systemically racist' because they cover up these 'murders of clearly innocent young black men by police'.  Derek Chauvin would disagree.  So would Amber Guyger.  And scores of others who were charged, but cleared. 

Just an attempt here to agree with GhostFL that we need to ask other commenters to back up their claims to avoid discussions going off the deep end.  Peace, out. 

[badbluesplayer]

All I know is I'm an independent so I voted against the Nazis and Russians in the last presidential election.  Never again will I have that chance.

[Whitefang]

I've seen the body camera footage of a young black man walking past a small group of police officers(in San Fran I think) and walking in a slight direction AWAY from them and they opened fire on him, and killing him then claiming the typical "life in danger" BS excuse. 

How about the pre-teen black kid in Georgia(was it?) who got blown away by a police officer because the kid was holding a TOY GUN? 

And WHERE did I claim I believe it was the JUSTICE SYSTEM?  To me, the justice system refers to courts.  Which don't get involved until after the fact. 

I can't come up with any more "proof" as I'm not in the habit of taking notes when viewing the evening news, or cutting out clippings from the papers I read.

Listen.  I can make assumptions with the best of 'em.  And I can assume you believe all those rioting and destructive protesters have no real reasons to protest to begin with.  And that they only do so because they're driven by "wokeism".  

And while I'm bringing up "idiot-speak" again, let's address another one....

You might think it's "woke" form me to point out the use of the "idiot-speak" term "Karens" is really unfair to those women actually NAMED Karen who don't necessarily behave in the manner the women that term is referring to do. 

Whitefang

[badbluesplayer]

One thing I' figured out about ten years ago that most of you don't need to worry about...

I worked in construction and half of people in that biz are lying m-fers.  I'd have to know who's lying to do my job. So I ;learned ovee time how to tell who's lying.

1.  Liars can't keep the natural tension in one particular face muscle.  I don't know what it's called, but I can tell when somebody's lying pretty much all the time by watching that muscle.  It's uncanny.  I've tested it by watching the Maury show and I was right like 102% of the time.

2.  You don't have to know anything about what people are talking about to tell who's full of boloney.  You just have to figure out who's arguing about the facts instead of the principles.  Liars argue the facts.

Anyway, you worldbeaters go for it.  And keep arguing the facts.  😄

[Whitefang]

11 minutes ago, badbluesplayer said:

 

 I was right like 102% of the time.

 

That's a lower percentage than all those guys on the show were sure they WEREN'T the Daddy!  

Their range is 120-150%!   

Whitefang

[badbluesplayer]

You sure can tell who has the Mike MyPillow broflake bobblehead dolls around here.

Here, lemme run a scan on y'all's microchips...

[jaxson50]

14 minutes ago, Whitefang said:

I've seen the body camera footage of a young black man walking past a small group of police officers(in San Fran I think) and walking in a slight direction AWAY from them and they opened fire on him, and killing him then claiming the typical "life in danger" BS excuse. 

How about the pre-teen black kid in Georgia(was it?) who got blown away by a police officer because the kid was holding a TOY GUN? 

And WHERE did I claim I believe it was the JUSTICE SYSTEM?  To me, the justice system refers to courts.  Which don't get involved until after the fact. 

I can't come up with any more "proof" as I'm not in the habit of taking notes when viewing the evening news, or cutting out clippings from the papers I read.

Listen.  I can make assumptions with the best of 'em.  And I can assume you believe all those rioting and destructive protesters have no real reasons to protest to begin with.  And that they only do so because they're driven by "wokeism".  

And while I'm bringing up "idiot-speak" again, let's address another one....

You might think it's "woke" form me to point out the use of the "idiot-speak" term "Karens" is really unfair to those women actually NAMED Karen who don't necessarily behave in the manner the women that term is referring to do. 

Whitefang

Not to nitpick,  but in regards to the officer shooting of a young person holding a toy gun,, maybe  the entire story was not presented to you .

A 911 caller reported a person with a hand gun in a park/play ground. In an area that had a problem with gang shootings,  the officer's where advised to approach with caution.  When the first officers arrived they ordered the suspect to drop the gun, he refused, turned toward the officer's,  the rest is history.  The toy gun originally had an orange muzzle , by law it's required so officers know it's a toy, however the young person had painted it black so it would look authentic,  perhaps to impress gang members in the area, maybe to carry out more nefarious activities,  like armed robbery.  

Given the information the officer's had, what could you have done any different?

Real life isn't a video game.  Cops don't bluff,  if someone pulled a toy gun that had been modified to look like a real gun would you tell the difference in a split second?