NeoConMan Posted March 1, 2010 Share Posted March 1, 2010 According to the Better Business Bureau, Gibson gets a grade of D- ... http://www.bbb.org/nashville/business-reviews/musical-instruments-wholesale-and-manufacturers/gibson-guitar-corporation-in-nashville-tn-12398 Now, don't get me wrong. Gibson is a privately held company, it's really none of my business what they do there. I'm not an investor or an employee. They could fill the offices full of salt water and go deep sea fishing in them - I don't care. I'm but a lowly customer who still romantically buys in to the myth, the legend. I'm somebody who has purchased tens of thousands of dollars worth of their product. And it would seem, oddly enough, that maybe I'm more concerned about the tarnished perception of the company than ANYBODY in Tennessee seems to be. Henry Juszkiewicz and Dave Berryman evidently have a vision that I don't share. Maybe I'm just not as smart or business-savvy as they are, so I don't get it. But I'm beginning to pity the poor bastards that still go to work there everyday, and do the best job they can to create the very products that bring dreams to life and make people feel things that they cannot experience any other way. Henry, if you're reading this, your tenure as a hero in the guitar business is over. Do us all a favor, and look closely at the condition of Gibson that led to its near demise in the 1980's before you so gallantly rode to the rescue and seized the reins of the company. The Norlin years are beginning to look like the "good old days" from where I stand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeoConMan Posted March 1, 2010 Author Share Posted March 1, 2010 Wait a minute.... Maybe this will further weaken the market demand for Gibson guitars. More and more people will decide that Gibsons simply aren't worth the money - or Customer Service hassles. Values of new and used guitars will continue to drop. I can buy more used Gibsons for the same money... Okay. Nevermind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brundaddy Posted March 1, 2010 Share Posted March 1, 2010 I'm with you Neo. Tell it like it is! I quit buying new Gibsons long ago. I love the guitars/hate the corporation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanvillRob Posted March 1, 2010 Share Posted March 1, 2010 I'm but a lowly customer who still romantically buys in to the myth' date=' the legend. I'm somebody who has purchased tens of thousands of dollars worth of their product. And it would seem, oddly enough, that maybe I'm more concerned about the tarnished perception of the company than ANYBODY in Tennessee seems to be. [/quote'] I wonder if this spills over to the Bozeman factory? Pretty danged fine instruments if they're made by disgruntled employees...I'd MUCH rather they be "gruntled"!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hall Posted March 1, 2010 Share Posted March 1, 2010 No new electric ones for me either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichCI Posted March 1, 2010 Share Posted March 1, 2010 A D- is still a passing grade! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thundergod Posted March 1, 2010 Share Posted March 1, 2010 I'm with you Neo. Tell it like it is! I quit buying new Gibsons long ago. I love the guitars/hate the corporation. +1 Their guitars might be good' date=' but their business model isn't (from the customer's point of view and needs). Time to do as Neo and vote with our wallets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cdntac Posted March 1, 2010 Share Posted March 1, 2010 That rating is based on 11 complaints. I honestly don't know.... Is that a lot? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie brown Posted March 1, 2010 Share Posted March 1, 2010 It's interesting. One Gibson guitar I'd still love to have (ES-345), and I saw one in a store recently, that had all kinds of "orange peel" in the the headstock area, and on the sides of'' body, as well. Also, the "action" was so high, you'd only be able to play "slide" on it. Where the neck met the body, the paint had bubbled, and it was not sanded out, or buffed, beyond what you might expect a "faded" finish to be like. WTF...Gibson?!! You expect anyone to pay over $3, 600 bucks, (MF price) for THAT?! NOT!!!! I've seen recent SG (White) customs, with the same problems. Amazing! I own a lot of Gibson guitars, from the 50's to 2002....but unless/until they get their act together, I won't be buying any "new" ones, either. The Custom shop versions, seem to be less prone, to these problems...but, paying 4 times the price, for something that should be done "right," in the first place, is "criminal"....IMHO. Have a nice day, HENRY! CB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Allen Posted March 1, 2010 Share Posted March 1, 2010 That rating is based on 11 complaints. I honestly don't know.... Is that a lot? As a business owner myself, and have been one for 10 years, I take EVERY customer complaint seriously. It only takes one bad review to tarnish a business. I love Gibsons, especially the 335, but I do recall that whole fiasco with the robot guitar and darkfire where people all over the world were pissed. From a business perspective, it seemed pretty clear that they mishandled all that. And besides, is it ok for my son to have a D- based only on 11 bad grades? Would you want to eat at a restaurant that has a D- based only on 11 bad reviews? I see what you mean, it could be a matter of scale, but to me, it still doesn't bode well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeoConMan Posted March 1, 2010 Author Share Posted March 1, 2010 That rating is based on 11 complaints. I honestly don't know.... Is that a lot? Complaints that go unheeded? Clearly demonstrating that they really don't care, eh? Yeah, I saw that too. Not like it's ten thousand complaints at the BBB. But they have to know what a high profile avenue of complaint that is. I would bend over backwards to keep a customer from lodging a formal complaint against my business. But what do we all know about "problems" with new Gibsons? It's a regular thing - almost like a production option. "You want sh!tty paint/nasty binding with that? No? How about a Dark Fire instead? Or a Chinese guitar?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocketman Posted March 1, 2010 Share Posted March 1, 2010 One complaint unheeded is one complaint too many. Henry probably knows his tenure should be over but I bet his ego is getting in the way. No one of us like to be told that we are not good enough. So Gibson sues PRS over the Les Paul design. Maybe instead of doing this they should learn from them. PRS is making $30,000 true custom guitars and is selling them! Instead Gibson makes the robot guitar and Hendrix model. Forget about gimmicks. They just don't work. My tech told me that Gibson is horrible to work with in terms of repairs. On the other hand a company like Taylor is great and they are known for it. He told me that a pickup system went out on a guitar that was way past its warranty. Taylor said to him "don't worry about, we'll take care of it." I bet his customer was very happy! Bottom line: you can't go wrong by applying the old adage "customer first." It's so simple yet I don't understand why it gets overlooked by so many companies, including Gibson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deepblue Posted March 1, 2010 Share Posted March 1, 2010 Gibson Laughing--------------> Bank Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackie Posted March 1, 2010 Share Posted March 1, 2010 Bank---------------------> Henry Laughing----------------> pole dancin girls, booze................ wait a min .....................they have my address....................... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeoConMan Posted March 1, 2010 Author Share Posted March 1, 2010 You know, there's another aspect of this that should not go unmentioned. Production problems, crappy finishes, craftsmanship issues, QA/QC with holes big enough to drive a truck thru... Who's fault are they really? Any organization has slackers and people on the floor who just don't give a sh!t. I seriously doubt that's the issue at Gibson, and those guys and gals for the most part want to do the job right. And if you wanted to see which people should stay and which people should go in a lay-off, look at their work. Maybe somebody should go ask the guys on the production floor how to fix it. THEY are the ones doing the best they can with what they got. Do they need more time for a task? Do they need better tools? Do they suffer with equipment that doesn't function properly? Are they told to ignore this and not to worry about that? Does the climate and environment (formed from the top down) dictate that they do a sh!tty job? When's the last time a manager fixed a fxcking thing? How about going to the people who CAN fix it, and empowering them to do so? Then let the sh!t-heeled managers go ahead and take credit for it at the next executive meeting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazzboy Posted March 1, 2010 Share Posted March 1, 2010 Wait until the company gets an F. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red 333 Posted March 1, 2010 Share Posted March 1, 2010 You have to take Better Business ratings with a grain of salt. If a customer complains to a company, and also to the BBB, and the company resolves the customer's issue and then neither the customer or the company reports the resolution, the BBB has no way of knowing the customer is satisfied. Red 333 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeoConMan Posted March 1, 2010 Author Share Posted March 1, 2010 If it was my company name being smeared in public, you can bet I would find a resolution. Gibson is legendary for doing exactly what the BBB is warning people about. Everybody involved is doing exactly as we've come to expect..... So Gibson sues PRS over the Les Paul design. STUPID! I was glad the Supreme Court refused to hear it' date=' and let the lower court ruling stand. PRS making a guitar that looks like a Les Paul? Really? Which one? Seriously, which PRS looks like a Les Paul? The Singlecut is the model that was the issue, it looks like a Les Paul the same way I dance like Fred Astaire. Not even close. Yet, name a company that makes a Les Paul-style carved top guitar that would be hard to tell apart at a distance. Well, Grestsch has been doing it for 50 years. Guild. Then start naming off all the smaller import lines. ESP maybe? All kinds of foreign companies have been ripping the Les Paul off for years. But PRS actually stole the high end market from Gibson, so that's who they sued. You know what? PRS didn't steal the high-end market from Gibson, hell, they [i']created[/i] it in an area Gibson never even dreamed of. Compete, or die Gibson. Here's hoping you'll learn to compete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zigzag Posted March 1, 2010 Share Posted March 1, 2010 That rating is based on 11 complaints. I honestly don't know.... Is that a lot? Those are only the ones who took the time to register a complaint. I wonder how many of those complaints came from authorized dealers? Also, it is likely that if their customer service handled the issue to the customer's satisfaction, no complaint was lodged. I am actually surprised that there aren't more complaints. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FirstMeasure Posted March 1, 2010 Share Posted March 1, 2010 Gibson Laughing--------------> Bank Yep, and the guys who ruin the company image cash in the biggest bonus. Usually right before they jump ship. Plunder and Scuttle is the business model of the 21st Century. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red 333 Posted March 1, 2010 Share Posted March 1, 2010 My tech told me that Gibson is horrible to work with in terms of repairs. On the other hand a company like Taylor is great and they are known for it. He told me that a pickup system went out on a guitar that was way past its warranty. Taylor said to him "don't worry about' date=' we'll take care of it." I bet his customer was very happy! [/quote'] I bought a Gibson electric that had fallen of a store's wall and got a crack in its top. Since I got such a tremendous deal, I thought It would be worth it to send it off to Gibson Repair and Restoration. I sent it off, got an estimate of four hundred dollars, and authorized them to fix it. They did fix it. FREE OF CHARGE. Red 333 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeoConMan Posted March 1, 2010 Author Share Posted March 1, 2010 Wow, Red... Okay, keep telling us more good stories like that. Cuz I have first-hand knowledge of about twenty that went nothing like that. Ho long ago was this? So, who saves Norl... er, I mean Gibson THIS time? Probably not an American company. An icon of the music industry appears to being milked until it falls over and dies. The book will slam shut for good, surrounded by flies.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zigzag Posted March 1, 2010 Share Posted March 1, 2010 You have to take Better Business ratings with a grain of salt. If a customer complains to a company' date=' and also to the BBB, and the company resolves the customer's issue and then neither the customer or the company reports the resolution, the BBB has no way of knowing the customer is satisfied. Red 333[/quote'] My experience is that complaints are not lodged with the BBB unless the offending company will not resolve the issue to the customer's satisfaction. Also, registering a complaint with the BBB is a pain in the arse. I have felt like doing it many times, but only actually done it once, and even then I didn't care about restitution. I only wanted to damage the offending company. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeoConMan Posted March 1, 2010 Author Share Posted March 1, 2010 Also' date=' registering a complaint with the BBB is a pain in the arse. [/quote']I was going to do it a couple times as well, but gave up in the process. It is a pain indeed. Takes some effort and perserverance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanvillRob Posted March 1, 2010 Share Posted March 1, 2010 Would you want to eat at a restaurant that has a D- based only on 11 bad reviews? So I guess lunch in the Gibson Cafeteria is OUT of the question!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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