Relics - what's YOUR take on this "feature"?

[10PoundLester]

This whole "relic" thing started by Fender back in the 90's is a scam if you ask me. How? Because then they don't have to worry about the finishing process which in most cases is the most intense part of an instrument build. Nobody's gonna notice a little ding or a little bit of roughness on the insides of a guitar or in a pickup cavity or neck pocket. But if there's one tiny fleck of dust in an otherwise perfect finish the world be DAMNED - we have to discount it or start over! So the geniuses at Fender decided to not only let those dings and imperfections through the QC process but they can CHARGE EXTRA for them! Woo-Hoo! What do you think?

[jdgm]

OTOH there are Fender and other relic'd guitars with a finish beneath another relic'd finish.   That takes some doing. 

'Ordinary' relicing which you describe above  is similar to what antique dealers have always done to furniture.  

I don't want one thankyou - or any type of aged finish on a NEW guitar; they charge an awful lot with Fender seeming to do the most extreme relicing.  Of course they are Masterbuilt which  makes it...er, better. Or worth paying more. 

Extreme examples of signature relicing include the Pastorius Jazz bass, the SRV Strat (expensive version), the Rory Gallagher Strat, etc etc. 

The Gibson Johnny Winter Firebird -

https://www.gibson.com/en-US/Electric-Guitar/CUSK1U971/Polaris-White

The Murphy Lab.   Ultra Light, Light, Heavy or Ultra-Heavy, Sir? 

https://www.gibson.com/en-US/Collection/the-gibson-murphy-lab

 

Bizarre when you think about it objectively. 

But the Signature model, being an exact copy of the artist's old faithful, is different.  Think of 'Greeny' for instance...or the Bloomfield, Kossoff or Clapton limited editions.  

 

I am in the UK and I am constantly amazed that USA buyers can and do send their purchases back because of tiny flaws - and usually get results without any argument. 

Edited March 31, 2023 by jdgm

[rct]

People buy them and try to pass them off to their friends as old guitars.  If Fender and Gibson and all the others only sold guitars to guitar players they wouldn't sell any relics.  It's what happens when you sell guitars to people.

rct

[ksdaddy]

I had occasion to see one in person the other day. It was a black Stratocaster that looked like it had been drug across a gravel parking lot for about a month. 

First of all, I think it's stupid. Always have. Always will. 

Second, it goes against common sense. Guitars don't "age" that way. Think about it. Brand new 1962 Stratocaster, gets the heck played out of it. By 1970 it has lots of wear, dings, dents... starting to look like one of Fender's Custom Shop relics. Except the frets are now worn out. Old guys like me, think about it: How many average people would have had their 8 year old Strat refretted in 1970? It's just not something the average person would have had done, at least not like today. It would have been cast aside and a new one bought.  If the frets hadn't worn out, someone at some point would have sanded it down and painted it metallic blue to match their GTO.  And then by 1972 it would have been stripped and slathered with walnut stain (aka "hippie s*** brown"). Then in 1975 it would have been routed for humbuckers. Or more likely chiseled. By 1980 all the metal parts would have been replaced with brass and coil taps added. Speed knobs too. 1985 would bring out the router again for the Floyd Rose. And sometime in the last 10 years, whatever "old refinish" it would have had would have been completely redone in Fiesta Red or Lake Placid Blue, something that would add $3000 to it's gbase price (notice they almost never get refinished Shoreline Gold or Sherwood Green?).

The scenario I just laid out is a bit ludicrous, but a typical "old Strat" would typically  have undergone at least ONE of the aforementioned changes. The idea that they are creating a believable "old" guitar is laughable. 

Fender was stupid to have come up with the idea and every company that follows suit is also stupid.

[Dub-T-123]

I’m definitely not a fan. I like a lot of the vintage reissue stuff because I like the original guitars but relics are way too much

[sparquelito]

As a guitar player (and occasionally, the hopeless guitar collecting addict), I'm a fan of beautiful, shiny, nicely-functioning guitars.
I love the look and feel of a well-maintained, nicely polished guitar.
I take pains to be precious with my own guitars, and I keep them clean and lovingly maintained.

Back in the day, I did not find the notion of stars like Jimi Hendrix, Peter Townsend, and Paul Stanley smashing their guitars on stage exciting or attractive in any way.
I found it to be offensive to every hard working kid who had worked their paper route and regular jobs for months in order to save up and buy a guitar in the first place.

During the brief punk rock era, I understood the punk fashion and how those guys hammered on their utilitarian guitars and basses, and had them covered in stickers and grimy electrical tape.
But I didn't enjoy the notion of it.
Not artistically, and not aesthetically.
Seemed like 'instrument abuse'.

So.
To the question of 'relic-ing' perfectly good guitars.
I'm not a fan.

I get it that it's a curious, improbable money-maker for Fender.
So I salute their business savvy.
I hope they make lots of money.

But I won't ever contribute to their business model when it comes to purchasing a 'relic-ed' guitar.
No sir.

😗

 

[merciful-evans]

The last guitar I bought was a 1998 LP DC Standard. It was someone's regular gigging guitar. Its been well used. It might not look too bad in photos, but it has buckle worming and  a couple of bits of rash. There are dings all over and the gold plating is heavily worn. I like it showing its age, but I would never have bought a new guitar that looked like that. 

For me its about 'being faked'. I don't even mind the look of a well done relic, but I hate the idea of it being a fake. And that's before you get around to paying the premium on top.

Like everyone here, I try to keep my guitars looking as pristine as they can.

I knew one player who did his own relicing with a blowtorch and sandpaper. He was laughed at and jeered by his bandmates when he did that.

On the inverse side of the topic. I have a bassist friend who has three pre CBS Precisions. He had one of them professionally refinished because it was severely worn and he felt his bands image needed tidy looking instruments. I don't know if he regrets that now, but it was the right decision at the time. 

[ksdaddy]

I prefer to UNpunk a guitar when presented the opportunity. (This used to have Hell’s Bells for audio but it was removed by YT.)

 

[kidblast]

Artificially aged guitars is nothing I have any interest in purchasing.   The amount of money people will pony up for them is astounding to me, but it's their money so, there is that.  One of my acquaintances has two murphy labs LPs, he paid around 10k for both of them.  He doesn't have a great job, and he's not an accomplished player, but these 2 ML Les Pauls, he's proud of them, he loves the he11 out of them and plays them every day.   not what I would dump 20k in but - he's happy So,,  

Me?  I'd rather go in the opposite direction like the last post from Scott..

I was given this at the start of February last year.  It was leaning up against a barn, outside in New Hampshire, in the wintertime in a "Pickers" back yard.

 

By the middle of May, the restoration was complete.

 

Scott actually bought the neck when I decided I wasn't going to try to restore it.   No regrets there either.

BTW... Scott, how'd you make out with that?

Edited April 1, 2023 by kidblast

[ksdaddy]

I actually bailed on that project. I did restore the neck to a great degree, repairing the cracks in the fretboard and leveling / clearcoating  the face of the headstock. My issue was the market price of a 60s or 70s body. They are asking (and getting) over $1000 for something with 5 coats of Minwax Polyshades slathered on it, or routed for three humbuckers. I’m still on the hunt for a Jazzmaster, with a Jaguar as a distant second choice. I’m tempted to build my own surf guitar using a newer US Strat with Jazzmaster pickups. I would do it piecemeal so I wouldn’t destroy an already intact guitar. A few months ago there was a 1983 (wide) Strat neck on a sunburst 1988 body with aftermarket pickups, would have been spot on perfect but I drug my feet. 

[Karloff]

I like RCT's comment.    They're not for me. I have zero interest in them. 

 

[kidblast]

3 minutes ago, ksdaddy said:

I actually bailed on that project. I did restore the neck to a great degree, repairing the cracks in the fretboard and leveling / clearcoating  the face of the headstock. My issue was the market price of a 60s or 70s body. They are asking (and getting) over $1000 for something with 5 coats of Minwax Polyshades slathered on it, or routed for three humbuckers. I’m still on the hunt for a Jazzmaster, with a Jaguar as a distant second choice. I’m tempted to build my own surf guitar using a newer US Strat with Jazzmaster pickups. I would do it piecemeal so I wouldn’t destroy an already intact guitar. A few months ago there was a 1983 (wide) Strat neck on a sunburst 1988 body with aftermarket pickups, would have been spot on perfect but I drug my feet. 

I didn't realize the market was that inflated for these.

Hopefully you can find something to attach it to.  If you still have my email handy,  can you send a pic or 2?

I'd love to see how far you got that neck.

I hated to not use it but I felt it was beyond my know how to bring it back.

[Murph]

Low self-esteem. 

Never actually earned any money.

[Notes_Norton]

I don't like them at all. But to each their own.

IMO they rarely look like normal aging, instead, distressing. But if someone else likes them, it's OK with me.

I gig for a living, and I wish my instruments didn't get so much visual wear and tear.

 

Notes ♫

[ksdaddy]

1 hour ago, kidblast said:

I'd love to see how far you got that neck.

I hated to not use it but I felt it was beyond my know how to bring it back.

I sold everything. I'm fickle like that. Projects that are truncated for any reason are typically sold off. Seldom do they go on the shelf for later revival. I'm happy with how the neck turned out though.

[Pinch]

15 hours ago, jdgm said:

OTOH there are Fender and other relic'd guitars with a finish beneath another relic'd finish.   That takes some doing. 

Christ... 

OT: I'm not paying extra for someone to beat up a guitar for me. Simple as that. Some will, and if they're happy, I'm happy for them. 

[Pinch]

6 minutes ago, ksdaddy said:

I sold everything. I'm fickle like that. Projects that are truncated for any reason are typically sold off. Seldom do they go on the shelf for later revival. I'm happy with how the neck turned out though.

Nice repair! 

[Whitefang]

If I'm going to buy a new guitar that was made to look "old" and used, then I wouldn't pay more for it than I'd pay for a used and old guitar.  And to those who would pay a higher price for them.....

I have a really nice bridge I'd like to sell ya too.  

Whitefang

[kidblast]

1 hour ago, ksdaddy said:

I sold everything. I'm fickle like that. Projects that are truncated for any reason are typically sold off. Seldom do they go on the shelf for later revival. I'm happy with how the neck turned out though.

wow..  that is incredible.  I should have had you give me the restoration estimate!!!  Awesome job Scott.

 

[merciful-evans]

Not very different from buying these new jeans.

I had some genuine worn out jeans with a tear in the knee & the a$$ gone out at the back. I could have washed them & put a fancy name tag on and asked £99 on Etsy.

[Notes_Norton]

The fashion industry decided jeans last too long, which means you don't buy a new pair soon enough, which means they make less money.

So they decide jeans with holes in them are 'in fashion', get the trend setters to wear them, and the holy jeans wear out over twice as fast as the non-distressed jeans do. It's all about the profits.

I have never bought a pair of jeans with holes in the, although I've worn out a few pairs that eventually had holes in them.

Notes ♫

[duane v]

I'm good either way... some are done with taste and others look like a kid got a hold of it to use as a baseball bat

[Whitefang]

Yep.  Some, like me, would benefit by using a "bat" that covers the strike zone.  😜

Whitefang

Edited April 6, 2023 by Whitefang

[Pinch]

On 4/1/2023 at 10:25 AM, sparquelito said:

Back in the day, I did not find the notion of stars like Jimi Hendrix, Peter Townsend, and Paul Stanley smashing their guitars on stage exciting or attractive in any way.
I found it to be offensive to every hard working kid who had worked their paper route and regular jobs for months in order to save up and buy a guitar in the first place.


😗

 

This. 

[RBSinTo]

I don't understand why anyone would pay for a new instrument that was finished to look old, and beaten up.  Obviously some people would, and do, but I'm not among them. 

My guitars (all purchased used) have their little dings and cosmetic use imperfections, but I am careful not to add to their inventories.

To each his own.

RBSinTo